Because it is the cheapo way of reducing backpressure instead of coughing the cash to
get a larger A/R housing, and work the turbo as it was meant to be.
And that would definitely justify that outrageous cost...but still be no value for money mod.
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Because it is the cheapo way of reducing backpressure instead of coughing the cash to
get a larger A/R housing, and work the turbo as it was meant to be.
And that would definitely justify that outrageous cost...but still be no value for money mod.
APR's stage III was meant to be used with stock rods.
Their stage IV on the other hand pushes the turbo to it's true potential.
"Laggy" is something one learns to live with when going bigger turbo.It occurs because the
larger wheels have different inertia and it takes more exhaust gases to spin them.But that is
unavoidable if you want to push more air into the engine.Different exhaust A/R's make a difference
but also limit top end power.
You can't have something for nothing....
Poverty
Guest
This hybrid seems to be best of both worlds, faster spool and better top end in a warranty friendly package and I would argue more reliable
APR stage 3 bent a stock rod also.
This hybrid seems to be best of both worlds, faster spool and better top end in a warranty friendly package and I would argue more reliable
APR stage 3 bent a stock rod also.
Turbo efficiency can be altered through other engine mods.Still, there is a limit
to what a turbo can flow and what pressure it can maintain in the upper revs
to make the torque that makes the horsepower.There is no "best of both worlds" when
it comes to turbo's.It's simply a mediocre improvement for a SH*TLOAD of cash...
I don't really see the market for is at that price...For a hybrid to be at least viable,
it would have to include a rebuild option and be around the 600 to 700 Euro price.
Anything above that is getting close to new/bigger BB turbo, and it's not worth it.
And i don't really see how a "modified" (and hugely untested ) turbo can be more reliable
than a sealed Garrett turbo direct from the manufacturer.....
Marketing is nice and all , but truth must be told...
Poverty
Guest
the sealed turbo will be more durable but a whole BT package usually requires a hell of alot more TLC and comes with its fair share of issues
That is also true, but if you already have opened up the engine for rods to support
that HP, you are also prepared for the rest.
Still, the question here is not how much HP is enough, but if the money for this
turbo is worth the horsepower it is rated for (and is yet to be real life proven btw).
Also, everyone keeps forgetting ANY turbo that supposedly makes +50BHP is gonna
require a retune, and i don't see any major tuners lining up for that.
A GT3071R kit on the other hand already has MANY software choices available...
Poverty
Guest
Poverty
Guest
LOL - and so not true also
And why do you think that ??
Why don't turbines come clipped from the manufacturer then ?
same reason they dont come as hybrids and mix and match... They are made to a spec to perform an OE job..
People who want more, change components.. Using your rather flawed rational, anything not done same as manufactuers cant be good.. I have news for you... They are often shyte at their design jobs.. as exposed by others who improve on designs and gain performance.
Poverty
Guest
From Loba:
The GT3071 build is a big thing to do. I do not exactly know what costs one's looking at if turbo, exhaust manifold and other parts ought to be replaced. Anyhow, I think that the LO380 and GT3071 are quite different characters.
The GT is one big turbo and that surely makes power.
Here's why we do not use an aftermarket exhaust manifold with a Garrett turbo:
Modern TFSI engines run pretty high combustion temps in favor of higher hp output, efficiency and emissions. Now aftermarket headers are made of D5 or D5S steels, as well as Garrett's turbos. D5 is prone to cracking when exposed to constant temps greater than 900°C. The OEM material used is 1.4848 - withstanding constant temps of up to 1100°C.
If you're not stressing your Garrett turbo too extensively for a longer time there should not be any problem. But since we've been developing our products for the German market where people really drive at WOT for quite a while due to no speed limits selling a product that could fail because of aforementioned problem would be pretty much adverse.
We have made quite a few experiences in terms of longevity and therefore chose to go that way.
We are developing two new stages of our turbo both of which will be made bolt-on fitment in accord with OEM quality standards. We are aiming at 450 respectively 500 hp.
The GT3071 build is a big thing to do. I do not exactly know what costs one's looking at if turbo, exhaust manifold and other parts ought to be replaced. Anyhow, I think that the LO380 and GT3071 are quite different characters.
The GT is one big turbo and that surely makes power.
Here's why we do not use an aftermarket exhaust manifold with a Garrett turbo:
Modern TFSI engines run pretty high combustion temps in favor of higher hp output, efficiency and emissions. Now aftermarket headers are made of D5 or D5S steels, as well as Garrett's turbos. D5 is prone to cracking when exposed to constant temps greater than 900°C. The OEM material used is 1.4848 - withstanding constant temps of up to 1100°C.
If you're not stressing your Garrett turbo too extensively for a longer time there should not be any problem. But since we've been developing our products for the German market where people really drive at WOT for quite a while due to no speed limits selling a product that could fail because of aforementioned problem would be pretty much adverse.
We have made quite a few experiences in terms of longevity and therefore chose to go that way.
We are developing two new stages of our turbo both of which will be made bolt-on fitment in accord with OEM quality standards. We are aiming at 450 respectively 500 hp.
Deleted member 53697
Guest
Correct me if i'm wrong but I read that as they are developing a 450bhp or 500bhp solution using the OEM exhaust manifold?
Also, when they say "we are developing two new stages of our turbo" surely they don't mean the K04 hybrid but some of the shelf big turbo they have modified?
Sounds swell but price is gonna be the deciding factor here... Knowing Germans it will most likely be expensive
Also, when they say "we are developing two new stages of our turbo" surely they don't mean the K04 hybrid but some of the shelf big turbo they have modified?
Sounds swell but price is gonna be the deciding factor here... Knowing Germans it will most likely be expensive
Deleted member 53697
Guest
I must say I'd never heard of them before but they are sorta one of the forerunners for having the first universally accepted 500bhp+ hybrid turbo solution for the TTRS 2.5TFSI.
It seems that they "cut their teeth" in the marketplace with a 2.0TFSI hybrid K04 turbo which has never been particularly succesful and few people have software solutions for it.
Effectivley, MRC Tuning are their UK dealers and from what I can see they are the only people who do software for the Loba products, which is all custom written by one person.
These turbo solutions are only as good as the people who write software for them and the fact that Revo/APR/GIAC/Unitronic don't touch hybrid turbo's with a barge-pole has got to say something.
That said, I would certainly be tempted by a "proven" 400bhp+ hybrid turbo but I sure as hell wouldn't be the first person to go down this route...
It seems that they "cut their teeth" in the marketplace with a 2.0TFSI hybrid K04 turbo which has never been particularly succesful and few people have software solutions for it.
Effectivley, MRC Tuning are their UK dealers and from what I can see they are the only people who do software for the Loba products, which is all custom written by one person.
These turbo solutions are only as good as the people who write software for them and the fact that Revo/APR/GIAC/Unitronic don't touch hybrid turbo's with a barge-pole has got to say something.
That said, I would certainly be tempted by a "proven" 400bhp+ hybrid turbo but I sure as hell wouldn't be the first person to go down this route...
if i was after 400 bhp it would certainly not be on this platform !
maybe a mk5 R32 either supercharged or turbo charged ,
i would imagine thats why hurdy and johnny c have gone the way they have.
it sounds great having the power but in realiity is it such a good thing?
if it could be a guaranteed road and traffic performer then maybe i would change my mind but after speaking to the guys at storm having a dustbin sized turbo bolted onto your car isnt the most practical of solutions
Please elaborate on that.
I am stuck between getting a BT and just improving on the car as it is
cause i don't want to mess with BT issues such as fueling and wear..
Plus i don't believe you can use all that power a 3071R has to offer, and also
have a daily driver.
Deleted member 53697
Guest
once the Cupra is gone, a mortgage on my own house is underway and i've saved a few quid over a couple of years; i'm gonna go out and blow 40k on a 09 plate DSG R32 with all the options and either twin rotrex of twin turbos
well that's the plan anyways!Poverty
Guest
LOBA are a german company, who make uprated turbos, manifolds, down pipes, intercoolers and more. They work closely with audi, and their manifolds etc are cast in the same factory as OEM VAG manifolds for example.
They are a good company who know their stuff.
Complete BT kits have alot of drawbacks also, just ask DanGB for starters.
If it was me, these kits on an S3 would be ideal, but TBH if you get OEM like power delivery with these hyrbids, on a cupra FWD chassis I cant see traction being that bad as with a BT kit, where its . nothing, nothing, nothing, bang!
interesting thread this..
re egt's, the tuning will determin the temps run, so is not 1100'c sustained if you dont make it run so hard.
BT's run cooler.. they are larger framed and their efficiency range is appropriate for their power output, where smaller framed units like hybrids are going to be punching above their weight so to speak.
BT GT30, on 1900cc 1.8t on 26psi boost was no more than 850'c on sustained load... with appropriate tuning. Lean it out and yep, egt's will rise.. retard timing, and same thing.. tuning is a huge influence on this..
Loba's sole justification for this does'nt sound correct to me.. Its their choice to persue hybrids, and hybrids have their place for sure... but at what point does the investment in a smaller frame turbo, trying to achieve larger framed turbo outputs, forcing high egt's then become the wrong direction in respect of reliability..
answers on a postcard
re egt's, the tuning will determin the temps run, so is not 1100'c sustained if you dont make it run so hard.
BT's run cooler.. they are larger framed and their efficiency range is appropriate for their power output, where smaller framed units like hybrids are going to be punching above their weight so to speak.
BT GT30, on 1900cc 1.8t on 26psi boost was no more than 850'c on sustained load... with appropriate tuning. Lean it out and yep, egt's will rise.. retard timing, and same thing.. tuning is a huge influence on this..
Loba's sole justification for this does'nt sound correct to me.. Its their choice to persue hybrids, and hybrids have their place for sure... but at what point does the investment in a smaller frame turbo, trying to achieve larger framed turbo outputs, forcing high egt's then become the wrong direction in respect of reliability..
answers on a postcard
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