Leon Cupra R Performance

[S1MMA]

Just so happens I was browsing your forum when I came across this.

I'm from the Fiat Coupe forum www.fccuk.org/forum

For comparison, a standard coupe 20VT does indeed do 0-100 in 14.5s, but it also has a 1/4 mile time of 14.5s, whilst a Leon Cupra R 210bhp has a 18s 0-100 time and a 15.2 1/4 @ 92mph. The 225bhp version may get in the late 16s 0-100 and an early 15s 1/4 mile (around 15 flat IIRC).

My car is chipped only (circa 250bhp) and I managed a 13.95 1/4 mile. I've seen a few chipped (Revo/jabba) running the 1/4 mile and most manage a mid to late 14s time. see here: http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=39866

The driving experience between the 2 cars will be slightly different, (comparing say 2 standard cars together, or 2 chipped cars) with the leon suffering less lag, although the Fiat Coupe 20VT can hold more boost past 5000rpm to the 7000rpm redline. So off the mark the leon will have the advantage, but higher up through the gears the Fiat will be faster.

Round town, getting on the power the leon will have the advantage. On an open road/motorway or on track the coupe 20VT will be faster. Also, the TC on the leon's suck (as you all know) whilst we have a viscous coupling LSD - which helps us put the power down off the line pretty well, and gives for entertaining handling under power.

And any of you monkeys that think a Leon Cupra R can waste a 20VT coupe, I welcome you to waste me or any of the other similar powered coupes (compared to yourself), although you may be a bit surprised at the result. although I appreciate this was limited to a few of your less educated members - we have the same sh1t on our forum too.

for the chap wondering what rpm the power kicks in on a standard coupe, peak torque of 228 lb/ft is made at 2500rpm, although below this pretty much nothing happens in a 20VT coupe.

My friend has a 200bhp jabba'd ibiza (cupra_jeff on here) and his car really does get a good jump off the line or when both booting it at the same time. Spool up on his k03 is much better than my T28, although top end its a no contest - the coupe 20vt beats it fairly convincingly (from 5000rpm in second upwards pretty much).

 

[StuRox]

Well, just for my pennies worth - I have owned both.

As standard the coupe 20vt is quick and has an advantage of a long geared 3rd, so you can get a quick 0-100 time.

So if both standard then IMHO the coupe is quicker.

As for modded - well I had my coupe up to 340BHP, and it was bloomin quick - a lot quicker than my LCR, but that was only up to around 270BHP.

However, the coupe was only really great in a straight line - even after I had the suspension etc done, the LCR even as standard can easily out handle the coupe.

As for looks - the coupe has an aquired taste - I liked it - the Mrs hated it, but it got lots of looks - whether these were admirers or thinking yuk - who knows.

Make you own choice, as here is a pic of my old one:

But don't expect to blow one away, as you may get a nasty surprise

 

[S1MMA]

sorry, but I think the standard examples of a coupe look better than most modded examples. The LE or Turbo Plus kit sets the cars off nicely - I don't really think spoilers etc... suit the car.

Here's a nice example, beats anything out of spain/germany for style (I've been driving only VWs for 7 years till I got the Fiat so I'm not a VAG virgin or anything):

 

[Ruddmeister]

Here's a nice example, beats anything out of spain/germany for style (I've been driving only VWs for 7 years till I got the Fiat so I'm not a VAG virgin or anything):

Styling is about personal taste so I would disagree about the looks of the Fiat, but hey each to his own

I do agree (and did before, see previous page) that the Fiat has the performance to match / better the LCR

One comment from earlier was that you said
"whilst a Leon Cupra R 210bhp has a 18s 0-100 time and a 15.2 1/4 @ 92mph. The 225bhp version may get in the late 16s 0-100 and an early 15s 1/4 mile (around 15 flat IIRC)."

There is bugger all difference between the 210 and the 225 and I think both are around 16.

I have also seen plenty of 1/4mile miles around 14-15secs for modified LCR's confirming they are fairly close to the Fiat's performance....not done 1/4mile stuff myself though, not my cup of tea.

 

[S1MMA]

fair enough on the styling point of view, each to their own.

On the point of handling, the Fiat Coupe is regarded to be one of the best FWD handling cars ever made, along with the Corrado VR6 and Integra Type R. The inclusion of the LSD instead of a power sapping TC system really does make for a different experience. One of the best things you could do to a tuned MK2 golf, or a MK3 VR6 was adding a Quaife LSD, and I'm sure the higher power 20VTs are using an LSD of some sort. Don't underestimate the coupe 20VT's handling either is my point! It's a 5* EVO rated car and is strong in may areas.

 

[Ruddmeister]

One of the best things you could do to a tuned MK2 golf, or a MK3 VR6 was adding a Quaife LSD, and I'm sure the higher power 20VTs are using an LSD of some sort.

No they don't as standard and I personaly would fit a Peloquin or Quaife ATB Diff.

 

[S1MMA]

I know they don't have an LSD as standard (rely on the ABS sensor TCS), just saying if you were running a high power 1.8t then it would be a good idea to fit an LSD and throw away the rubbish standard TCS.

 

[YerMother]

The Coupe had a electronically controlled diff if i remember right (some form of TCS!) And as said they are quick, 220bhp standard and i'm sure they did a limited edition that was 240 with a 6 speed box (Might have imagined that) and they weigh around 70kgs less than the LCR!

I still think they're a stunning car (looks and performance) i wanted one for years but was hard to get a low mileage one!

 

[Ruddmeister]

I know they don't have an LSD as standard (rely on the ABS sensor TCS), just saying if you were running a high power 1.8t then it would be a good idea to fit an LSD and throw away the rubbish standard TCS.

If you have driven an LCR you will know the TCS is fairly good, doesn't come in very early, my comment was also to use an ATB diff not LSD.

You can turn TCS off (well 50%+ off (not 100% off)) in the car and having driven an LCR with the TCS turned off and the Quaife ATB it's fun to drive if a little wierd at first.

In fact it was Yermothers car above which has the Quaife ATB

 

[S1MMA]

The Coupe had a electronically controlled diff if i remember right (some form of TCS!) And as said they are quick, 220bhp standard and i'm sure they did a limited edition that was 240 with a 6 speed box (Might have imagined that) and they weigh around 70kgs less than the LCR!

I still think they're a stunning car (looks and performance) i wanted one for years but was hard to get a low mileage one

The diff on the coupe is a Viscous Coupling, not electronically controlled. Have a look on howstuffoworks.com for an explanation of how it works.

The Limited edition version has a 6sp box, but no more power than a standard coupe. Few choice extra's in the LE, and some nice colours also.

 

[Ben CTR]

My car is chipped only (circa 250bhp) and I managed a 13.95 1/4 mile. I've seen a few chipped (Revo/jabba) running the 1/4 mile and most manage a mid to late 14s time. see here: http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=39866

Only ran my LCR once so far (will be run plenty this year). It was at the end of July last year in 32 degrees temps and it ran a 14.2 @ 98mph (At Pod). That was with 4,000 miles on the clock with just the Revo remap. I shall be running it again very soon (maybe this month 29th). If I don't get into the 13's with a simular terminal speed to yourself at some point this year... I'd be very very suprised.....

 

[S1MMA]

what mods/power are you running mate?

 

[Ben CTR]

Just Revo remap mate. Was rolling roaded at 265 bhp and 298lb/ft on about 5,000 miles. I've since done 20,000 miles since then and added panel filter and bailey DV. But shouldn't think that'll make to much difference to power figure. Will be getting it RR again at some point this year...

 

[S1MMA]

what have the other chaps in their revo LCR's been running at the pod?

The thing with 1.8T peak power/torque figures is that they are usually inflated via aggressive overboost. My friends K03 ibiza overboosts to like 20psi IIRC, great for a split second on the rollers - not so good on the turbo/clutch etc....

We usually use aftermarket manual or electronic boost controllers on our cars, that eliminates most of the overboost. What revs were the peak power and torque produced at by the way and how did the torque curve look?

 

[jonathanp]

I think scotty_b got 14.2 1/4 when his car was standard? would of thought 0-100 would be 15 maybe under

when I had my car running between 230-250bhp (when it worked) it could do 0-100 in 13.89 with APR on

 

[Ben CTR]

what have the other chaps in their revo LCR's been running at the pod?

The thing with 1.8T peak power/torque figures is that they are usually inflated via aggressive overboost. My friends K03 ibiza overboosts to like 20psi IIRC, great for a split second on the rollers - not so good on the turbo/clutch etc....

We usually use aftermarket manual or electronic boost controllers on our cars, that eliminates most of the overboost. What revs were the peak power and torque produced at by the way and how did the torque curve look?

Peak power was at 5850rpm and peak Torque 3500rpm. The torque Curve does tail off very very slightly, but not a massive amount really... The car pulls well all the way to about 6500rpm to.
If you're at Pod this year mate. I'll give you a run.... ?

 

[Ben CTR]

I think scotty_b got 14.2 1/4 when his car was standard? would of thought 0-100 would be 15 maybe under

when I had my car running between 230-250bhp (when it worked) it could do 0-100 in 13.89 with APR on

I doubt very much he ran a 14.2 STANDARD mate. I seem to remember him running a 14.3 with Remap...

 

[Cupra_Jeff]

what have the other chaps in their revo LCR's been running at the pod?

The thing with 1.8T peak power/torque figures is that they are usually inflated via aggressive overboost. My friends K03 ibiza overboosts to like 20psi IIRC, great for a split second on the rollers - not so good on the turbo/clutch etc....

We usually use aftermarket manual or electronic boost controllers on our cars, that eliminates most of the overboost. What revs were the peak power and torque produced at by the way and how did the torque curve look?

Haha alright mate !! I wondered how long it would be before you got here, you trading in the punto and getting a real car ?

Mine doesn't overboost to as much as 20 psi more like 18 psi... you are right about the agressive overboost, but don't forget though that is on a K03, the bigger K04 and twin intercoolers does help matters a lot !!

As much as I like the LCR don't bother at Santa Pod, you will get cained down the standing 1/4 as its all about the launch and the non-lsd seats don't really like launching (although i did get a 2.19s 60' once)

Not sure I agree with the Fiat being the best handling car (along with a corrado ??!! nice 1975 chassis !!) that big old lump of, odd cylinder, unbalanced pig iron you call an engine can't be good for the weight distribution.

 

[Al_G]

My best mate used to have a Fiat 20V Turbo and although it was extremely fast in a straight line (sounded like Darth Vader when flooring it in first) he used to say it handled very poorly. While he'll admit that down the strip it would have beaten his brothers CTR and my other best mates Integra type R, he admits that it was no way near as planted on corners...He say's the best handling cars he's ever driven (handling wise) are his old clio williams, Integra Type R and FQ340.

 

[GreyKnight]

Well back in October 2005 Classic Car magazine did a feature on six cars which they thought where worth buying as a used sports car. The cars on offer were the Aston Martin DB7, the S1 Lotus Elise, the Subaru Impreza Turbo, the TVR Chimaera 4.0, the Mazda MX5 and..... ......the Fiat Coupe 20V Turbo

Well I couldn't understand how that crept in there either, but regardless it did.

Their specs for the Fiat were:-

Engine type: 2.0l 5 cylinder dohc 20v Turbo
Power & Torque: 220bhp @ 5750rpm, 228lb ft @ 2500rpm
Transmission: 5 speed manual, front wheel drive
Weight: 1310kg
Top Speed: 155mph
0-60mph: 6.6sec

So. The stats show that it would be slightly quicker than a standard LCR, which supposedly has a 0-60 time of 6.8ish secs, and that it also has a slightly higher top speed.

However it looks, er, different (IMHO) and only does 23mpg.

They did say however that it handled quite well, limited body roll and lots of grip.