DPJ's GTRS Eliminator Install and Development

[DPJ]

Can't remember - I posted it some time ago, but can't find it now...

I've got 69mm & 64mm from one of Bill's posts.

So if the scaling is only to take account of the MAF being in a bigger tube...
((69/2)^2) / (64/2)^2) gives a factor of 1.16 (212 g/s x 1.16 = 245 g/s)

212 g/s x 1.16 x 1.31 would give 322 bhp.


- or not.......

 

[Wilko]

Dave
I did exactly the same sum last night, though I reckon the scale factor is 1.12 (69vs65), and though 230-235g/s at 1.45 bar on a small port? Sounds about right to me.

 

[Feel]

Not sure you can use the 1.31. An LCR uses that ratio of air to make X power.

I was reading that LCR Airflow thread last night looking for the MAF ID

Anyway 310-320 is about right for a GTRS isn't it?

 

[DPJ]

Dave
I did exactly the same sum last night, though I reckon the scale factor is 1.12 (69vs65), and though 230-235g/s at 1.45 bar on a small port? Sounds about right to me.

I got the 64 from a thread with where you and Bill were discussing MAFs! I had my LC MAF tube in my hand last night. Tape measure, but I stared at it long, hard (and sober) and I'd have given it no more than 63mm! I'll go with what you say though! Thank you for that.

Not sure you can use the 1.31. An LCR uses that ratio of air to make X power.

I was reading that LCR Airflow thread last night looking for the MAF ID

Anyway 310-320 is about right for a GTRS isn't it?

BHP range should be right Phil, I'm just surprised (and have doubt) I'm there so soon. I've yet to pin Mr Hall down on the MAF scaling (and factor) though Wilko probably already has.

Where does this leave me?
I'll run it on T6 HB6 day to day for now, and I won't thrash it (a lot) - I'm a bit concerned about heat issues in the ATP manifold.
I'll give the intercooler some more air today.
Walbro 255l (arrived) inline pump on in the next week.
Within the next couple of weeks, I'll get the shifter bracket remade so I can put a 70-80 straight reducer directly onto the sleeved compressor inlet, then 80mm 90elbow up. I thought I'd get an 80mm alloy coupler modified so it's got a DV inlet and N75 connectors etc to go upright above that. Then 90 degree elbow to the MAF.

Then get it on the rollers.

I've got the secondary air to remove, N249 to bypass and I'll get an oil catch tank.

Any other suggestions are more than welcomed.

 

[The MoffMeister]

the n249 apparently isnt all that but you still going for it?

 

[DPJ]

the n249 apparently isnt all that but you still going for it?

I've read the 'how to' threads often enough. It would tidy things up a bit, I suppose.

 

[PhilW]

Looking good dave, bet its flying. Gotta be happy with 20psi at 7k tho.

What petrol you running and what plugs at what gap?


You gona try to do the TIP like we mentioned previously, with the elbow straight off the turbo? You think a 45 degree would work?

 

[DPJ]

Looking good dave, bet its flying. Gotta be happy with 20psi at 7k tho.

What petrol you running and what plugs at what gap?


You gona try to do the TIP like we mentioned previously, with the elbow straight off the turbo? You think a 45 degree would work?

Hi Phil,
Always V-Power.
The plugs are the dealer supplied ones from about 15k ago. You think I should put something else in.

I've looked and I can't go down with a tip close to the turbo.

I'm going to put an 80-70 straight reducer on the sleeved compressor inlet, then go to an 80mm 90 degree bend up. (both under a cable bracket). Then, I'm going to have a coupler with DV/N75 etc inlets on it. Then 90 degrees to the MAF.

 

[PhilW]

I think something colder with a smaller gap would be better. PFR6Q, IK22, BKR7's would do the trick, maybe with a .028" gap or smaller.

 

[DPJ]

I think something colder with a smaller gap would be better. PFR6Q, IK22, BKR7's would do the trick, maybe with a .028" gap or smaller.

Which ones would you use, Phil?

I spent some time performing surgery on my front bumper today and made a duct from the bottom of the skirt to feed the bottom rows of the intercooler. After all that, the bumper still doesn't fit properly - the two sections either side of the top middle grille stick out about an inch further than the bonnet.

Here are the logs after giving the intercooler a tad more air...

HB7 T7 21 degrees.

Sunday	5	August	2007	20:45:09			
06A 906 032 HN		1.8L R4/5VT         0002					

Group A:	'003			Group B:	'020		
Idle speed	Air mass in	Throt Angle	Ignit Angle	Idle Stabilization	Idle Stabilization	Idle Stabilization	Idle Stabilization
 /min	 g/s	%	 °BTDC	 CF	 CF	 CF	 CF
3040	58.14	62.7	30.8	0	0	0	3
3280	69.42	99.6	27.8	0	0	0	3
3600	85.72	100	25.5	0	0	0	3
3920	105.42	100	19.5	0	3	0	2.3
4320	134.06	100	12	0	3	0	2.3
4720	160.56	100	9.8	0	3	0	2.3
5200	183.44	100	12.8	0	3	0	2.3
5680	197.42	100	14.3	0	3	3	1.5
6120	201.75	100	12.8	0	2.3	3	1.5
6440	199.22	100	15	0	2.3	3	1.5
6800	210.08	100	15.8	3	2.3	2.3	1.5
7040	210.25	100	20.3	3	1.5	5.3	0.8

Sunday	5	August	2007	20:47:48	
06A 906 032 HN		1.8L R4/5VT         0002			

Group A:	'115			Group B:	'031
Engine Speed	Engine Load	Spec. Boost	Actual Boost	Lambda Factor	Lambda Factor
 /min	%	 mbar	 mbar		
3680	120.3	2260	1580	0.86	0.852
3920	138.3	2360	1870	0.821	0.821
4120	151.9	2430	2110	0.813	0.813
4360	165.4	2430	2270	0.789	0.805
4600	176.7	2420	2410	0.797	0.805
4840	182.7	2420	2390	0.789	0.805
5080	184.2	2410	2520	0.782	0.805
5280	181.2	2400	2520	0.782	0.805
5520	175.2	2410	2400	0.797	0.805
5760	176.7	2400	2410	0.789	0.805
5920	176.7	2390	2380	0.805	0.805
6080	172.2	2390	2350	0.797	0.805
6280	167.7	2390	2280	0.797	0.805
6480	169.2	2410	2390	0.805	0.805
6640	162.4	2410	2510	0.789	0.805
6720	163.9	2400	2390	0.789	0.805

1.5 bar at 6640 rpm!

Sunday	5	August	2007	20:50:28	
06A 906 032 HN		1.8L R4/5VT         0002			

Group A:	'118			Group B:	'032
Engine Speed	Air Temp In	Boost Dut Cyc	Actual Boost	Idle O2 Adapt	Run O2 Adapt
700-6800 RPM	<=110 C	0-100% 	<=1800 mbar	-10.1	-10.1
 /min	°C	%	 mbar	%	%
2640	30	100	1140	0.9	3.9
2720	30	100	1260	0.9	3.9
2880	30	100	1350	0.9	3.9
3040	30	100	1420	0.9	3.9
3200	30	100	1500	0.9	3.9
3360	30	100	1570	0.9	3.9
3520	30	100	1650	0.9	3.9
3720	30	100	1770	0.9	3.9
3960	30	100	1940	0.9	3.9
4200	30	100	2140	0.9	3.9
4440	32	95.3	2320	0.9	3.9
4720	33	73.3	2420	0.9	3.9
4960	33	70.6	2460	0.9	3.9
5200	35	62	2460	0.9	3.9
5440	36	54.9	2450	0.9	3.9
5640	37	53.3	2370	0.9	3.9
5840	39	52.5	2340	0.9	3.9
6000	39	54.5	2340	0.9	3.9
6200	40	72.2	2440	0.9	3.9
6360	42	67.1	2460	0.9	3.9
6480	42	64.3	2450	0.9	3.9
6720	44	60	2430	0.9	3.9
6800	45	59.6	2330	0.9	3.9

So 118 isn't showing any real change in IC temps, but I've got lower CFs...

 

[PhilW]

It might be adapting to it now.

I cant believe your WG duty tho dave, not trying that hard is it? Spools pretty slow tho.

 

[DPJ]

..... ................ Spools pretty slow tho.

I have to drop a cog to make things happen now.

..........But it's worth it when it happens!

I don't think improving the TIP is going to change the spool, do you?

 

[Martyn]

Dave, are you resetting the ecu after making changes with the SPS?

 

[DPJ]

Dave, are you resetting the ecu after making changes with the SPS?

No Martyn. I did a TBA before I started all the logging on Friday, that's it.

 

[Martyn]

Ahh okies. I always found I got better results by setting the Boost/timing and then resetting the ECU after. You know you wanna bung it on HB9/T6

 

[DPJ]

Ahh okies. I always found I got better results by setting the Boost/timing and then resetting the ECU after. You know you wanna bung it on HB9/T6

I'll try resetting the ECU tonight Marts.
I want a Spinal Tap SPS3 with 11 on it.

 

[Molehill_Mike]

I have to drop a cog to make things happen now.

..........But it's worth it when it happens!

I don't think improving the TIP is going to change the spool, do you?

Dunno if I am way off course here but...

The Ibiza std TIPs are crap, when I uprated the TIP on the Blue Cupra to a Forge one, the turbo spooled alot quicker AND alot louder!

Made a huge difference...

...I also recommend resetting the ECU each time you adjust the settings, again on the blue Cupra you could really feel the difference without having to wait for it to adapt!

Just my 2p...

Mike

 

[Martyn]

Mike, Dave has a ATP 3" inlet mate.

I always found I got better results by setting the Boost/timing and then resetting the ECU after.

 

[DPJ]

Dunno if I am way off course here but...

The Ibiza std TIPs are crap, when I uprated the TIP on the Blue Cupra to a Forge one, the turbo spooled alot quicker AND alot louder!

Made a huge difference...

Just my 2p...

Mike

No, that's a valid point Mike. My ATP TIP is fine (big dia), until it gets to the curious oval pipe, which is probably equivalent to 60mm dia. Then, the pipe I've got onto the compressor inlet has a step in it, which could be restrictive.

I will redo it so it's got a fat straight pipe onto the compressor inlet. I just need to get the shifter linkage bracket rebuilt as a bridge over it.

 

[Molehill_Mike]

So does it go above 60mm down to 60mm then up again?

Or under 60mm up to 60mm, back down to under 60mm?

Just wondering, if pressure might come into the equation? Sucking a hell of a lot of air in...

Dunno, just a thought?

I think a fat pipe straight onto compressor inlet would help, means the flow of air stays constant...

Mike