I've got an interesting chart that I'm working on to demonstrate the various 'costs' of the Leon over the years
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MK3 Leon Cupra, what we know
- Thread starter Adman77
- Start date
I've got an interesting chart that I'm working on to demonstrate the various 'costs' of the Leon over the years
Think you missed my point Al, i am saying that we all have our own opinions. Its a forum, people like and dislike, get over it. 
You must accept that 'performance cars' are the small volume of a car manufacturers sales on an annual basis.
Of the 1000's of Golfs sold last year, how many were Golf R's, if we all had that kind of coin to throw about VW dealers would be working 2 days a week and living in golden palaces. The reality is that a manufacturer needs to sell in volume, and at a price point that is competitive.
The new Cupra will sell or it won't sell thats the black and white situation of it.
If SEAT continue to pull themselves out of the financial hole they got into during the noughties the leash is all the more likely to be loosened and possibly something will get signed off that is a bit special in the future.
But that's currently how it is, we can bleat over the hows and whys for as long as we like.
Comparing cars is down to a personal preference and the personal situation, the ability to afford what you want and getting the most for your money are generally the important factors. But you know I accept some of us have other factors they see as important. But that's why we have a choice to go and spend our hard earned how we like isn't it.
Just because some don't like it, doesn't mean others won't like it. That's the only point I'm making.
The fact your not a fan doesn't mean I don't value your opinions, it genuinely interests me. But the negatives do tend to try and shout down anyone with a positive spin.
You must accept that 'performance cars' are the small volume of a car manufacturers sales on an annual basis.
Of the 1000's of Golfs sold last year, how many were Golf R's, if we all had that kind of coin to throw about VW dealers would be working 2 days a week and living in golden palaces. The reality is that a manufacturer needs to sell in volume, and at a price point that is competitive.
The new Cupra will sell or it won't sell thats the black and white situation of it.
If SEAT continue to pull themselves out of the financial hole they got into during the noughties the leash is all the more likely to be loosened and possibly something will get signed off that is a bit special in the future.
But that's currently how it is, we can bleat over the hows and whys for as long as we like.
Comparing cars is down to a personal preference and the personal situation, the ability to afford what you want and getting the most for your money are generally the important factors. But you know I accept some of us have other factors they see as important. But that's why we have a choice to go and spend our hard earned how we like isn't it.
Just because some don't like it, doesn't mean others won't like it. That's the only point I'm making.
The fact your not a fan doesn't mean I don't value your opinions, it genuinely interests me. But the negatives do tend to try and shout down anyone with a positive spin.
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Ta, its a great car, really pleased with it. I think that's part of the reason I'm not being hard on the Cupra because I know how good the Leon is as a product.
It was a hard decision to make going for the FR this time, having been a power player for so long.
But I've not regretted it. Its giving me more financial freedom. Dropping £30k plus on a car was just not going to happen this time around.
My current goal is to just save money for a few years while the performance market dust settles, and see what takes my fancy in 3 years.
My reply was at the post before yours Mark. You happened to get a reply in first!
Agreed with your post though. It is very easy to be negative about things and ignore the positives. I have posted many times in this thread already with positives. And I have said I would have happily had the Cupra 280 if SEAT had at least released details in Q4 2013 about the specification if nothing else, and there have been quite a few others that have jumped ship as a result of this too. And for sure, the pinnacle model will sell less units and the price reflects this. If everyone could have a Cupra for the price of a basic spec model, they would have it. The Cupra is a cash cow and therefore an important model for SEAT, that's why its release so soon in to its lifespan will help it gain those precious sales and importantly, the revenue.
With regard to the looks, although even for me its not up to much, I would be able to live with the "stealth" because the specification is great and because bargains are bound to be had with it. The front drive, DSG, LSD, DCC and ample brakes is where it needed to be. The interior is where it needed to be. The performance is where it needed to be. On a dry road, on the move, it will pass an S3 or a Golf R. On a twisty road, in the dry, it will be faster than an S3 or a Golf R. It will be quicker point to point and in a straight line than an Astra VXR, Focus ST/RS and importantly the Golf GTi.
It seems that although SEAT have learned, they could still use some lessons from the likes of Ford and Vauxhall by way of listening to those with the £'s to buy their product and keep them interested rather than keeping them guessing.
Agreed with your post though. It is very easy to be negative about things and ignore the positives. I have posted many times in this thread already with positives. And I have said I would have happily had the Cupra 280 if SEAT had at least released details in Q4 2013 about the specification if nothing else, and there have been quite a few others that have jumped ship as a result of this too. And for sure, the pinnacle model will sell less units and the price reflects this. If everyone could have a Cupra for the price of a basic spec model, they would have it. The Cupra is a cash cow and therefore an important model for SEAT, that's why its release so soon in to its lifespan will help it gain those precious sales and importantly, the revenue.
With regard to the looks, although even for me its not up to much, I would be able to live with the "stealth" because the specification is great and because bargains are bound to be had with it. The front drive, DSG, LSD, DCC and ample brakes is where it needed to be. The interior is where it needed to be. The performance is where it needed to be. On a dry road, on the move, it will pass an S3 or a Golf R. On a twisty road, in the dry, it will be faster than an S3 or a Golf R. It will be quicker point to point and in a straight line than an Astra VXR, Focus ST/RS and importantly the Golf GTi.
It seems that although SEAT have learned, they could still use some lessons from the likes of Ford and Vauxhall by way of listening to those with the £'s to buy their product and keep them interested rather than keeping them guessing.
With regard to discounts, a quick Google showed this deal on Broadspeed for a 1.8T FR Leon 5 door with no options
PRICE QUOTE -
New Seat Leon
1.8 DSG - Petrol Automatic - 5dr Hatch
£22,020 - Retail Price Without Your Options
£18,738 - Our Price Without Your Options
£0 - Cost Of Your Options
£22,020 - Retail Price With Your Options
£18,738 - Our Price With Options (inc VAT & 12m Tax, OTR)
I calculate that as a 17.5% discount which would suggest that a few months down the road, the £28k tag will be £23.1k assuming similar discounts will be available on the Cupra like it is for its FR siblings
Bargain
PRICE QUOTE -
New Seat Leon
1.8 DSG - Petrol Automatic - 5dr Hatch
£22,020 - Retail Price Without Your Options
£18,738 - Our Price Without Your Options
£0 - Cost Of Your Options
£22,020 - Retail Price With Your Options
£18,738 - Our Price With Options (inc VAT & 12m Tax, OTR)
I calculate that as a 17.5% discount which would suggest that a few months down the road, the £28k tag will be £23.1k assuming similar discounts will be available on the Cupra like it is for its FR siblings
Bargain
I agree with that, but they have actually turned this car out a lot faster than the last one. It was more than 6 months after the initial Mk2 Cupra announcement that it landed in the UK.
It was 18 months after the Mk2 Leon that the Mk2 Cupra was announced.
This time they have previewed it early and made it available to order, and will formally launch it at Geneva in March that will be in dealers showrooms the same month.
The trouble is I think the whole Mk3 leon project was delayed, generally because I believe the car got scrapped early on in its development and they re-evaluated their strategy to one where they marketed the car with more choice. The knock on delayed everything else in turn.
It was 18 months after the Mk2 Leon that the Mk2 Cupra was announced.
This time they have previewed it early and made it available to order, and will formally launch it at Geneva in March that will be in dealers showrooms the same month.
The trouble is I think the whole Mk3 leon project was delayed, generally because I believe the car got scrapped early on in its development and they re-evaluated their strategy to one where they marketed the car with more choice. The knock on delayed everything else in turn.
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With regard to discounts, a quick Google showed this deal on Broadspeed for a 1.8T FR Leon 5 door with no options
PRICE QUOTE -
New Seat Leon
1.8 DSG - Petrol Automatic - 5dr Hatch
£22,020 - Retail Price Without Your Options
£18,738 - Our Price Without Your Options
£0 - Cost Of Your Options
£22,020 - Retail Price With Your Options
£18,738 - Our Price With Options (inc VAT & 12m Tax, OTR)
I calculate that as a 17.5% discount which would suggest that a few months down the road, the £28k tag will be £23.1k assuming similar discounts will be available on the Cupra like it is for its FR siblings
Bargain
I paid a lot for my Mk2 Cupra, probably too much, but I was an early adopter (pretty much one of the first factory orders with options that fell off the boat).
I was strict with myself this time that I would go bargain hunting, I did really well with the FR. I got pretty much what I was aiming to pay with all the options I wanted. Its a little more than the brokers prices, but were talking small change difference and I'm happy with the dealership so hopefully your buying some loyalty.
I don't know what the margins are on the new Cupra, but as I've said to people that have asked me, I'm prepared to wait out the market more now, and see what happens. I think you need to be strict and not let your heart rule your head too much. Especially these-days when money isn't growing on trees.
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This is the issue I have been wrestling with of late. I can afford to get the cupra ordered around June but in the same breathe, i can get a very well specced SC or even ST for that matter at less money which would be more than sufficient or i have the option of repurchasing my old mk2 cupra for cash this time, it has all the power in the world at stage 2+ and then just coast for a while until the MK3 cupra starts selling at discounted rates OR the MK3 cupra r gets released and wait a short while to get one of those. I hate being so indecisive
I paid a lot for my Mk2 Cupra, probably too much, but I was an early adopter (pretty much one of the first factory orders with options that fell off the boat).
I was strict with myself this time that I would go bargain hunting, I did really well with the FR. I got pretty much what I was aiming to pay with all the options I wanted. Its a little more than the brokers prices, but were talking small change difference and I'm happy with the dealership so hopefully your buying some loyalty.
I don't know what the margins are on the new Cupra, but as I've said to people that have asked me, I'm prepared to wait out the market more now, and see what happens. I think you need to be strict and not let your heart rule your head too much. Especially these-days when money isn't growing on trees.
On my first MK2, I got the car that allowed the dealer to make their target which meant a cracking deal. It was the first, and might be the last time I have ever bought a new car locally as the prices up our way are stupid because the North East of Scotland has its own microclimate fuelled by the oil industry.
On the second one, the deal wasn't there so I got the blue one from M1 Auto's in London just before they went bust. I don't mind travelling for a bargain - I am a Scotsman after all
This time, I was without a car which was the main reason I was hoping like hell that SEAT would give details away - they knew what it was months ago spec wise and could have kept interest for those needing a car as well as wanting a car. In the end, I couldn't wait any more and had to take the more expensive option which to be honest will be a pleasant change after 3 SEAT's - it will be my first Golf, second 4x4 car and first Automatic.
With regard to the margins in the new Cupra, I would imagine they will be smaller than the Golf GTi based on the extra standard kit - of course that will also depend on R&D costs, cost to build etc vs the Golf.
The cost to build the Cupra wont be the £10k more than the base model Leon and margin on the Cupra will depend on how much R&D went in to the Cupra project. I would have thought that the development costs for the MK3 Leon will be overall and not model specific though and this being the case, the cash cow comment above about the Cupra would therefore apply.
I am looking forward to having a shot of the Leon Cupra when it comes and it will be good to compare it to the Golf. Having driven the new S3 and a MK7 Golf GTi and being in a Leon FR, I'd say that from a drivers point of view, those buying the Leon Cupra will be in for a treat. I guess if you could take the Golf GTi exterior, S3 interior engine and running gear and Cupra kit and price you'd have the perfect car
DCC is standard on the leon iirc from what I have read, along with the diff whereas the golf has an electronic diff or something like that. Depreciation values aside the leon does have more kit as standard versus the golf. At the end of the day it will boil down to personal preference for folk regarding these cars. I suck because I am a loyalist and SEAT for me has always had more of an appeal than the golf.
ACC not DCC
acronyms all round. ACC is the cruise control these days
ACC not DCC
DCC dynamic chassis control The new generation of the DCC dynamic chassis control developed specifically for the Cupra is even more sensitive than that available with the Leon FR, adapting the chassis characteristics to the prevailing conditions in a matter of milliseconds.
From my understanding in the write up this is standard on the CUPRA or did i misread that?
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DCC is standard on the leon iirc from what I have read, along with the diff whereas the golf has an electronic diff or something like that. Depreciation values aside the leon does have more kit as standard versus the golf. At the end of the day it will boil down to personal preference for folk regarding these cars. I suck because I am a loyalist and SEAT for me has always had more of an appeal than the golf.
Yes but I said ACC not DCC
were going to get confused here but all I mean is some kit is an extra on a Leon that's standard on the golf
Yes but I said ACC not DCC
Ah, AC, DC, UC, IC we all C
That's what the cut out on the front bumper is I think. Presumably for the radar.
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As a comparison of its warm hatch sibling
I am 40yo (i know old git) in a brand new unmodified SC FR 1.8TSI DSG (valued to the insurers at its RRP of nearly £27k) with every bit of cover except breakdown cover. It has legal, hire car, guaranteed no claims cover. Parked on my drive, in a SK postcode was around £450 for the year.
I also have separate Gap insurance with ALA for a 3 years period, that was about £150 one off payment for the 3 years.
Could of got my car insurance for under £250 but thought the level of cover and the reviews from previous customers put me off the cheap and cheerful price. Cheap isn't always better.
Compared to my modified Mk2, all mods declared was getting on for nearly £680 a year
I am 40yo (i know old git) in a brand new unmodified SC FR 1.8TSI DSG (valued to the insurers at its RRP of nearly £27k) with every bit of cover except breakdown cover. It has legal, hire car, guaranteed no claims cover. Parked on my drive, in a SK postcode was around £450 for the year.
I also have separate Gap insurance with ALA for a 3 years period, that was about £150 one off payment for the 3 years.
Could of got my car insurance for under £250 but thought the level of cover and the reviews from previous customers put me off the cheap and cheerful price. Cheap isn't always better.
Compared to my modified Mk2, all mods declared was getting on for nearly £680 a year
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