Leon FR PD170 TDi Injector problem

[silverfox]

I had the same problem. Engine cutting out and wouldn't restart. Garage diagnosed as injector failure and Seat agreed to replace all four injectors and wiring loom. However, after replacing the parts and resetting fault codes the car fired up but then started to run with a misfire. Now the computer is logging a fault code P0200 - injector circuit open.

Can anyone explain what might be wrong here?

It's an independent garage who are doing the work so I'm not sure what kind of fault code reader they are using. I've been without my car for two weeks now and really starting to get quite frustrated. Garage are being really helpful but seem to be stumped.

Anybody able to shed any light on this? Over a month later and still no luck. ECU has been checked out but no faults found.

If I put the 4 old injectors back in, the car won't start. Four new injectors in result in a misfiring car and the P0200 error.

The car is now in a different garage and they are having all the same problems as original garage. All wiring checked out by both garages and can't find a fault.

Any techies out there seen this before? I'm on the verge of cracking up here!!!

 

[hambo_rambo]

All sorted! Got the car back with all four injectors and wiring replaced. RESULT!!! Thanks for all the help on this forum...

 

[hambo_rambo]

Silverfox. Have you spoken to Seat UK about your fault and can you get the car to a main dealer?

 

[silverfox]

Silverfox. Have you spoken to Seat UK about your fault and can you get the car to a main dealer?

Can't get the car to a main dealer. I'm based in Western Isles so no dealers nearby. Seat UK have paid for replacement of all four injectors as goodwill gesture but after replacing them (and wiring loom) I have come across this issue.

 

[EEE007]

I have had 2 failures of my injectors (2007 Leon FR Tdi PD170) first was in fast lane of A46 - 3 lane highway - cut dead with no warning - no PAS etc, had to do an emergency lane change with hazzards on - was nearly swiped by 1 car and wagon in slow lane before comming to rest on hard shouler- AA did not know what problem was. Taken to SEAT in coventry who diagnosed 1 x Injector no.2 and faulty flapper valve in inlet manifold. both changed as I had extended warrenty but NOT full SEAT dealership servicing so they made me pay for Manifold and Labour £750 total - NOT impressed.
2 months later I have been left stranded, this time failed in traffic - managed to limp home but then would not start next morning - NOW OUT of "Warranty" !!! I thankfully knew how to diagnose problem and found injector no.3 had shorted to ground.. Friend of mine has a breakers/Garage and he sourced me an injector - took no more than 1 hour to fit (first time doing this job.) and its running fine now.
There is obviously an inherrent problem with these injectors with either the Piezo coil or insulation breaking down. the real issue is that it causes the ECU to shutdown as all injectors are disabled due to short. a flawed design and a dangerous one at that. I am now not happy to drive the vehicle anywhere as are expecting no.1 or 4 injector to fail and either leave me stranded or worse injured in a crash. I FULLY intend to sell the vehicle now and will NOT be buying another SEAT/WV/AUDI/SKODA group 170PD or varient as I value my money and Life/families lives very much.. There should be a recall for this issue, I intend to write to SEAT UK and VOSA and also watchdog. to advise on the severity of this issue.

 

[Bookerman]

Just picked mine up after getting injector no1 and wiring loom replaced. Cars going great but on the short journey home I'm thinking I'm getting less MPG than before, would this make sense? Also with the wiring loom being changed does this mean the other injectors should be OK as I believe the loom causes the problem? I have a call in with SEAT asking whether they can say the car is safe to drive and I'm awaiting a call back. I notice they are very non-committal when you ask this question.
While in the garage I got talking to the mechanic who fixed it and he said they have 4 cars in at the moment with the exact same fault.
Anyway pleased to get it back and it's running well but don't think I can trust it and can see myself trading it in very soon.

 

[EEE007]

They do not know what causes the issue, or so they say, the wiring looms suffer from going brittle due to heat/oil. but the injectors are failing due to either insulation breaking down and or Piezo circuit shorting to earth. my loom is o.k the injectors failed... doubt if they will commit either way because if they do they are admitting liability as they know there is a problem.

 

[paulfs]

Trade in...

I can see lots of PD170 FRs at trade in soon, bang goes any residulal depreciation value

now, where's the closest Ford deale......................................................................................................................................................

 

[EEE007]

disgusted about this issue, they should admit liability and fix the problem its a serious accident waiting to happen. Im a confident driver with 20+years experience including racing, but when you left with a car with no power and no power assistance to steering/brakes on a motorway its no funny thing... I will not let my wife or kids near it now, and it'll sit in the garage untill sold... I loved this car untill these issues arose, power /economy / good looking and reliable otherwise, but I am now aware I'm not the only one and AUDI/VW/SKODA/SEAT PD170 engined cars are at risk before CR model change as far as I can be assured for now.

AND even if the injectors were £10 each it would not take away the fact that it is a dangerous thing to happen.

 

[Alzak]

i Have spoken with Seat Uk and they do not replace any injector before failure so we all will be driving like on bomb as You dont know when it decide to fail ...

We have to do something about it come on lads

 

[ibuckley]

As you may know from earlier in this thread I had one of my injectors replaced a few weeks ago. Seat UK did say they'd replace the rest if another was to fail. Unfortunately the threat of another potential failure happening has forced my hand and I'm sad to say I'm getting rid of my 56plate FR now. Loved the car and would probably have kept it a lot longer had this not happened, or Seat had replaced all four without prompting from me. But even hinting at not feeling safe there was no offer of replacement forthcoming so I've decided to get rid to be on the safe side. I hope VOSA act on this soon or Seat do something proactively and wish you all the best of luck and hope that your injectors continue to inject for many years to come.

 

[mri]

Hi SCN. Almost 2 months ago i payed almost 1000 euro for injector no 2 and loom. Today i went to Seat Indalo Motors in Almeria Spain and asked them if they received any new instruccions about 2.0 TDi faulty injectors. Prompt answer NO. They know nothing about those problems, but they knew about VW Passat injectors. So if i changed just injector no.2 and another one will fall down, then i`ll pay 1000 euro more. 10 minutes later, i went at local VW and Audi Garage, and guess what. They recognised, they know very well about those injector problems, and if you have one faulty injector and car has the original parts, they replace the injector for free, without beeing necessary to have a full VW or Audi Service History. As wee al know, Seat uses same enginees as VW and Audi. 20 minutes later i went back to Seat Almeria and asked them why VW AUDI pays for faulty injectors and SEAT not? Answer: They only follow instructions from Seat Martorell Barcelona Spain. So, it seems it`s not a VAG problem any more, it`s just Seat problem.

I forgot to mention, i went there with some printed pages from SCN and few other forum`s about this subject and the answer was: Anybody can write on the internet.

 

[paulfs]

VOSA Safety Defect Report

i Have spoken with Seat Uk and they do not replace any injector before failure so we all will be driving like on bomb as You dont know when it decide to fail ...

We have to do something about it come on lads

Fill them in chaps...

http://www.dft.gov.uk/vosa/onlineservices/vehicledefects.htm

 

[MatG]

Update guys and girls:

Spoke to SEAT UK today and they are replacing all 4 injectors and the loom free of charge, we have the courtesy car as well until it's ready. They actually said it's a known issue, did not argue it at all and were really pleasant to deal with.

All they did do was to check with our dealer to ensure we had the full service history.

Huge thanks to the forum and it's members for the help, potentially saved us £1000's.

 

[paulfs]

Revised Parts

Hello all,

My car is now having it's Injectors & Wiring Loom replaced as I type - pretty happy about that.

BUT, & a big BUT, neither the Dealer nor SEAT Customer Care can tell me if they are fitting new Revised Parts i.e. new ones that mitigate this known fault from happening again!

I have just written to SEAT Customer Care to confirm that they are indeed fitting revised parts, await the reply with interest.

Has anyone been told or aware if SEAT fit Revised Parts or is it just like for like & therefore we are driving around in an intrinsically un-safe vehicle! More details for VOSA!

 

[EEE007]

well the wiring loom has a different part code and the injectors have a new code also, this seems to dictate they are indeed revised in some way.

Injector old Code 03G 1300 73 M new Code 03G 1300 73 T

Not sure on wiring loom codes but advised by SEAT parts dept it is a diff code.
I dont think they will admit much as its admiting liability and also confirmation something wrong with old parts, will end up in multi million pound warranty claims and they would rather address each on a case by case basis than having to do a major recall.

 

[paulfs]

@ eee007

Thanks for that bud,

That sounds promising at least, feel a little more comfortable.

Can just imagine the claim if somebody has a serious accident that's a result of failed Injector / Loom cut-out - especially if SEAT are aware of the fault.

Haven't SEAT already admitted there's a fault anyway, if it isn't a fault why on earth are they paying for these to be replaced at their cost???

Feel another VOSA update coming...

 

[Bora]

SEAT won't be footing the ultimate bill, this will be passed down the chain to Semens as it's their design not VAG.

Yes it is a right pain in the ass but as faults happen and you contact Seat they appear to do the right thing, well speaking from our situation.

Also I can see why perhaps they don't do all four in no go, my first failed 2 years ago which would be around 35k miles. Last one went mothers day then they agreed to do other four, the next failed last Friday and the distance driven less than 200miles. Perhaps from there data most vehicles are fine, one failure is usually it anymore than that means they all come out?

I'm not sticking up for them as I have been in some dodgy positions when they have failed but it's all down to risk / cost on a recall for cars which are now 5years old and the majority out of the seat network for servicing etc.

It could be VAG group blocking recall due to the fact all brands would be effected and the cost associated or that Semens are blocking accountability and awaiting agreement that they will foot the bill.

Now ours are all done i'm more than happy keeping the car as we have had all the known faults, some of which we had to pay for. Perhaps my judgement is skewed as the car only cost me 5300 from new, perhaps!!

 

[paulfs]

Fair point Bora, wouldn't disagree over that & appreciate that it's all over risk, both in business & in life.
We all take the risk when we get behind the wheel, we know something may go wrong, but it's the difference between it may go wrong or when it will go wrong.
SEAT are a business & pride themselves on quality & drivers cars, this could seriously damage their reputation if someone was involved in a nasty accident due to this fault!
It is a fault, they can no longer deny it, they've already accepted liability, but what you're saying is that they have placed the cost of recall above that of a human life (or lives) & that doesn't sit well with me.
Honda didn't...

I will be happy if SEAT confirm that revised parts are fitted & I will continue to drive my 4year old FR, that's the risk we take.......

 

[paulfs]

Well done SEAT

Well, taking the recall discussuion aside, I am absolutely over the moon with SEAT - I've had the car back since Tuesday evening, all remaining Injectors & Wiring Loom replaced & she's running sweeter than ever 48.9mpg for 120m trip up the A34 @ 2500rpm Cruise Control, with cross country roads at start & finish - well impressed at that.

Also I have a £0.00 SEAT Dealer Invoice, plus a SEAT Customer Care voicemail confirming that the Injectors fitted are "new version" & "revised" parts respectively, so am pleased about that too, although I would prefer SEAT Customer Care to confirm that in a return email from my original question. Both have kept silent about the Wiring Loom at the moment, so I'll give that a day or two before I ask again.

On the whole I am very happy, impressed with both SEAT Customer Care & the Dealer, I shall be keeping the car...