Could my Dpf be on its wa out.

ash101

Active Member
May 6, 2010
160
0
Neath
My fr 170 runs nice for a day or two then it seems to be slightly down on power for a while it just dosnt feel so willing to go.I checked the dpf block 75 with vagcom yesterday it was 0% so it must have just regend.Today now its been running tip top untill I just niped down the shop and its back being not so nice.
Iv just checked with vagcom again and the lambda is at 11%.
Is it possible the dpf is getting clogged up and causing the engine to choke up??
Also does anyone know how to check the soot loading with vagcom?? I cant see any valuse anywhare for it.
I hate these DPFS!!!

Cheers
 

Nath.

The Gentlemans Express
Jan 1, 2006
8,619
16
EASTLEIGH, HAMPSHIRE
Is the 11% the soot load/mass???

Yes it is, Regen will kick in at 45% and go down to 0% if driven in regen mode contunually. At 0% regen will stop or if you switch off the engine at below about 10% regen will stop.

Sounds like your DPF is healthy and working fine to me. Maybe look at other reasons for the problem like MAF sensor, EGR valve or a leaking boost hose.
 

Nath.

The Gentlemans Express
Jan 1, 2006
8,619
16
EASTLEIGH, HAMPSHIRE
Some info for you.



There are 2 types of regeneration, passive and active

During long motorway journeys, passive regeneration will occur. This needs no intervention from the engine control unit. Due to the raised exhaust temperatures on a long journey
(temperatures between 350 and 500°C), the procedure occurs slowly and continuously across the catalytic-coated (with platinum) DPF. The catalytic-coated DPF is situated
close to the Engine, therefore the exhaust gas temperature is high enough (500°C) to ignite the soot particles.
Due to this soot is burned-off and is converted into a smaller amount of ash.

Active ‘regeneration’ is when the ECU intervenes when the soot loading in the DPF is calculated to be 45%. The procedure lasts for about 5 – 10 minutes. Specific measures are taken by
the ECU to raise the engine exhaust temperature to above 600°C, these include switching off the exhaust gas recirculation and increasing the fuel injection period to include a small
injection after the main injection. The soot particles are oxidised at this temperature.

The ECU will trigger a regeneration process, if for some reason this is aborted, ie. customer slows down, stops etc, the process will be resumed when
regeneration conditions are once again met, above 60km/h (38mph). This will continue for 15 minutes.
If after 2 attempts of 15 minutes, a successful regeneration has not been possible, the loading will increase. At 50% soot loading, the ECU will continue to
maintain maximum exhaust temperatures of 600°C to 650°C to cause a regeneration process. The system will try to run a regeneration process for 15
minutes. If unsuccessful, the system will repeat this process for a further 15 minutes, if still unsuccessful, the DPF light on the driver display panel will then be lit.


emergency forced regen

1.4l/1.9l/2.0l R4 & 2.5l R5 PD/PPD-TDI

Prerequisites (General):

Ignition ON
Engine ON (Idle)
Coolant Temperature above 50 °C (see MVB 002.4)
Particle Filter Load below Specification (see MVB 075.3, VAG-COM should give the specified value)
If the Particle Filter Load is above Specification the Particle Filter needs to be replaced since the car may burn down when regenerating.
Power Consumers ON (Light, Seat Heating, Front/Rear Window Heater, Climate Control)

Conditions (Driving Cycle):

Vehicle Speed between 30-60 km/h (18-37 MPH)
Engine Speed between 1500-2500 RPM (4th or 5th Gear, Automatic Transmission in Tiptronic)
Duration approx. 15-20 Minutes
Exhaust Gas Temperature before Turbo Charger above 700 °C

Drive the car based on the above conditions until the Particle Filter Load is as low as possible (close to 0*%). In case the regeneration fails there can either be problems with the Driving Cycle Conditions or with the Engine Hardware.

[Select]
[01 - Engine]

[Coding-II - 11]

Enable Regeneration by Entering 21295.

[Do It!]

[Meas. Blocks - 08]
Select both Groups at once 070 and 075.
[Go!]
MVB 070.1: Regeneration Status (xxxxxxx1 = Normal Regeneration active, xxxxxx1x = Forced Regeneration active)
MVB 070.3: Regeneration Counter/Timer
MVB 075.1: Exhaust Gas Temperature before Turbo Charger
MVB 075.2: Exhaust Gas Temperature before Particle Filter
MVB 075.3: Particle Filter Load
MVB 075.4: Exhaust Gas Temperature after Particle Filter

Now Start the Driving Cycle and keep watching the Measuring Blocks (2nd Person required).

[Done, Go Back]
[Close Controller, Go Back - 06]
 

Scooby250

Active Member
Dec 25, 2009
111
0
Colchester Essex
I hate to say it but it sounds very similar to my car which it ended up that I had a leaky injector so I had to get it changed. Have you noticed any extra smoke at all? Also does it feel like idling funny when you first start the car?
 

ash101

Active Member
May 6, 2010
160
0
Neath
Thanks Boys.

It seems to run realy sweet straight after a regen has been completed then gradually gets worse untill the next regen kicks in.

Iv just Had a new maf so it cant be that it does seem to be linked to the dpf and regen.

Im seriously thinking of a dpf delete I have a remap off a tuner I dont think im aloud to mention on here you know the one Lol.They do it where you cut open ur dpf and remove the internals and install new map. But I am thinking of buying a 2nd hand dpf so I have my orignal just incase There is any problems.
I have the sts sysytem so I can install the map myself.

What r ur thoughts on dpf delete???

cheers
 

ash101

Active Member
May 6, 2010
160
0
Neath
I hate to say it but it sounds very similar to my car which it ended up that I had a leaky injector so I had to get it changed. Have you noticed any extra smoke at all? Also does it feel like idling funny when you first start the car?

Hm No smoke but when you say idle funny I do notice it seems to idle a bit higher sometimes. When you say leaking injector do you know where/how it was leaking.

Cheers
 

Scooby250

Active Member
Dec 25, 2009
111
0
Colchester Essex
Not to sure how it was leaking, but your symptoms do sound similar to what I had as I also thought it was my dpf causing problems so I had the delete done and stage 2 remap. When this was done it was discovered my egr valve was sticking which was thought to be causing the excess smoke. I had that replaced which improved things for a while then the problem returned, chugging/idling funny alot of white smoke also loss of boost when this was happening.(which was 50% of the time) Took the car to 3 different garages and none of them could find a problem with the car. Only Jbs could diagnose finally that injector no3 was leaking. Had it replaced as well as the wiring loom and it has been fine since. (touch wood)
 

ash101

Active Member
May 6, 2010
160
0
Neath
Not to sure how it was leaking, but your symptoms do sound similar to what I had as I also thought it was my dpf causing problems so I had the delete done and stage 2 remap. When this was done it was discovered my egr valve was sticking which was thought to be causing the excess smoke. I had that replaced which improved things for a while then the problem returned, chugging/idling funny alot of white smoke also loss of boost when this was happening.(which was 50% of the time) Took the car to 3 different garages and none of them could find a problem with the car. Only Jbs could diagnose finally that injector no3 was leaking. Had it replaced as well as the wiring loom and it has been fine since. (touch wood)

The syptoms are not as bad as u described it just dosent seem so responsive and smooth running.
Who did you have ur dpf delete done with and how do you find it without it.Have u had any problems since it was done im thinking of getting it done.
Cheers
 

magicmcfc

Full Member
Aug 26, 2004
60
0
Just out of interest where are the injectors located on the engine?. Can you view them from above

Thanks
 

Scooby250

Active Member
Dec 25, 2009
111
0
Colchester Essex
I had my delete done at Jbs who did a great job and are really friendly.
I havent had any problems related to the delete.
Just to let you know you do get a bit more smoke with the dpf removed. You do get alot more power after it is done tho:clap:
 

FR_Flavoured

Guest
Any smoke at all will be more smoke because with a DPF you get zero smoke. I have never seen even a whisper of smoke from mine.

Are you tempted at all Nath to get the DPF delete done on yours?
 

Nath.

The Gentlemans Express
Jan 1, 2006
8,619
16
EASTLEIGH, HAMPSHIRE
Are you tempted at all Nath to get the DPF delete done on yours?

Maybe if I get problems after my warranty has run out and if I keep the car after 3 years, I would want to get the DPF delete but I wouldn't want 240BHP as this along with the silly torque kills the clutch and the engine mounts and tyres etc. 200BHP would be more than enough. I think you can have the DPF delete and keep standard power if you want.
 

FR_Flavoured

Guest
Interesting, good points raised. Cheers. ;)

To maintain reliability of having the DPF in place (ie: no smoke / risk of ECU faults and failures), you could instead just go for a Remap then - to see 200bhp quite comfortably?

Might be a silly question, answered many times :confused: but what bhp figures were we looking at, with just the DPF being removed + a mild map + ECU "correction" (to ignore/disable DPF sensor readings)??

I'm thinking having no DPF will instantly remove the associated worries of DPF issues, regens, pressure sensor faults etc (which I've had in the the past)...

Still see the DPF delete procedure as being in its infancy (with perhaps just a handful in THIS Mk2 Leon section who have done it)? Also I doubt outside of the "enthusiast" camp, most TDi FR owners out there driving these cars would not even be aware of this process!!?

£400 for the delete plus a map is tempting. Perhaps when/if my DPF packs up and the alternative is the £1000+ for a new filter, I'll turn to one of these tuning companies to have it removed. :)
 

ash101

Active Member
May 6, 2010
160
0
Neath
Sounds like your DPF is healthy and working fine to me. Maybe look at other reasons for the problem like MAF sensor, EGR valve or a leaking boost hose.[/QUOTE]

Yeah im happy now that my dpf is fine. After doing some research on the net I found out that the figure in vagcom meas block 68.2 is the actual soot loading ie.what soot remains in the dpf after regens.
As far as I can gather when this reaches 60 (grames i think it measured in) which normaly equates to aprox 90000 miles you would need a new dpf filter. Mine is reading 22.5 grams @ 39000 miles so if it carries on at the same rate im looking at replacment at aprox 110000 miles Touch wood!!!
 

ash101

Active Member
May 6, 2010
160
0
Neath
meas block 68.2 ?????? Where do you get the .2 from?

68 is the block .2 means 2nd row 1st is idle 2nd is soot mass/loading cant remember now what was in the 3rd I think it may of been lambda - 6 % or something
 
Nimbus hosting - Based solely in the UK.