Best bush setup for non-track use

[jcth1]

Thanks for the replies. My biggest concern was whether the poly bushes would hold up over time. I read some horror stories on VW forums almost 10 years ago.

Just mainly asking because I want to fit poly bushes to the Jetta in January and don't want to have to re do them again next year. Toronto has some rough roads.

 

[jcth1]

To be honest, and this might not be very popular, I can't say I've noticed a massive difference in handling with the polybushes. I think the biggest impact I've had was when I changed the rear beam bushes for polybushes, and even the cheaper ones made the car feel much more planted, but the fronts I can't say I noticed as big a difference as I'd hoped. I was hoping for everything to feel really solid, but while the steering felt less sloppy, that could have been because I changed the ball joints at the same time. I haven't noticed any issues with ride being any more harsh though, and the car's still plenty comfortable while also handling well.

That said, I've not driven much this year what with Covid and everything, and I haven't had much of a chance to give the car a real shakedown after changing the front and rear shock absorbers as well.

I'll be putting in a rear ARB next week, and I've heard that makes the biggest impact, so it might be a matter of saving money by using the OEM bushes and putting the money you've saved towards a rear ARB?

Rear ARB already sourced last weekend when I collected the car. Just gotta get it fitted.

 

[iammooks]

Thanks for the replies. My biggest concern was whether the poly bushes would hold up over time. I read some horror stories on VW forums almost 10 years ago.

Just mainly asking because I want to fit poly bushes to the Jetta in January and don't want to have to re do them again next year. Toronto has some rough roads.

I check them every time I jack up the car and they look absolutely fine - in fact the reason I went with them was because they're supposed to last longer than the OEM ones, so hopefully they'll last a long while yet.

Since installing them, the handling has been absolutely fine. I think for what I want handling wise it's more about stiffer suspension for that more planted feel. That said, rear beam bushes made such an amazing difference - whether you go OEM or polybush, if you stay on top of those, you'll be happy.


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[iammooks]

Rear bushes & fitting tool have been sitting on the passenger seat since September waiting for me to get around to it.

It's a horrible job, but worth it.


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[jcth1]

It's a horrible job, but worth it.


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Next question was going to be how difficult to do? Unfortunately for myself where I "live" in Toronto there is only a drive way for me to use and no garage. I go back end of Jan so I'm expecting minus 20 Celsius during the day.

Also only home for 6 days before returning to ol blighty for a few more months.

Would love to do the beam bushes and would happily buy them prior to flying out but can it also be done 1 side at a time with the beam on the car?

 

[iammooks]

Next question was going to be how difficult to do? Unfortunately for myself where I "live" in Toronto there is only a drive way for me to use and no garage. I go back end of Jan so I'm expecting minus 20 Celsius during the day.

Also only home for 6 days before returning to ol blighty for a few more months.

Would love to do the beam bushes and would happily buy them prior to flying out but can it also be done 1 side at a time with the beam on the car?

I did it on a driveway. It's a hard job in terms of it being pretty physical, not not anything technical.

I did one side at a time, but be warned that if you don't disconnect the brake lines (requires a bleed after) you'll need to cut into and bend the bracket that holds the brake hard line to be able to drop each side. It sounds worrying, but it's not so bad.

I made some bushing presses with some threaded rod and some metal discs I drilled a hole through the middle of. They'll work on control arm bushes too.

The only other thing to keep in mind is that it can be an awkward job. You spend a lot of time under the car trying to loosen bolts and both remove the old bushes and fit the new ones, and there's not much room to work.

Getting the old bushes out can be a bit involved too.

A home mechanic can do it no trouble though. I only started fixing my car a few years ago and other than sore muscles after for a few days, there wasn't anything about the job that I found really demanding.

And it's a very satisfying job to do - the difference in handling is huge.


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[jcth1]

I did it on a driveway. It's a hard job in terms of it being pretty physical, not not anything technical.

I did one side at a time, but be warned that if you don't disconnect the brake lines (requires a bleed after) you'll need to cut into and bend the bracket that holds the brake hard line to be able to drop each side. It sounds worrying, but it's not so bad.

I made some bushing presses with some threaded rod and some metal discs I drilled a hole through the middle of. They'll work on control arm bushes too.

The only other thing to keep in mind is that it can be an awkward job. You spend a lot of time under the car trying to loosen bolts and both remove the old bushes and fit the new ones, and there's not much room to work.

Getting the old bushes out can be a bit involved too.

A home mechanic can do it no trouble though. I only started fixing my car a few years ago and other than sore muscles after for a few days, there wasn't anything about the job that I found really demanding.

And it's a very satisfying job to do - the difference in handling is huge.


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Maybe a job for the summer then when I fly back over. Cheers for the reply.

 

[iammooks]

Maybe a job for the summer then when I fly back over. Cheers for the reply.

I did mine in January in rural Dorset and it was plenty cold. I've heard rumours that Canada can be even colder than that...

 

[jcth1]

I did mine in January in rural Dorset and it was plenty cold. I've heard rumours that Canada can be even colder than that...

Car is in Toronto so minus 28°c is the worst I have experienced there however when I did a night's work on Liam Neesons 'Ice road' movie in Jan 2020 it was minus 52°c in Winterpeg. Lived there for 18 months.

Check the credits under additional drivers. John Cox if one is curious

 

[Connor H]

Thanks for the replies. My biggest concern was whether the poly bushes would hold up over time. I read some horror stories on VW forums almost 10 years ago.

Just mainly asking because I want to fit poly bushes to the Jetta in January and don't want to have to re do them again next year. Toronto has some rough roads.

Spend the money one some TT/LCR wishbones, i have done all of the polybushing mk4 stuff and changing to these was a huge difference. The poly's on the pressed mk4 arms are **** and mine tore in a year granted i run it low.

 

[jcth1]

Spend the money one some TT/LCR wishbones, i have done all of the polybushing mk4 stuff and changing to these was a huge difference. The poly's on the pressed mk4 arms are **** and mine tore in a year granted i run it low.

Already have the tt front end lined up to collect soon. The PSB bushes I bought I fitted to some stock arms and will be fitting to my Jetta back in Canada first days of Feb next year. Standard height so I don't expect them to fail and they look decent with some flex built in with the black and red PSU molds.

Probably going to try the PSB on the tt arms and see how it goes. I won't be using the car much so if they fail I'll probably go back to stock R32/tt/LCR solid Bush.

Cheers for your input.

 

[Connor H]

Already have the tt front end lined up to collect soon. The PSB bushes I bought I fitted to some stock arms and will be fitting to my Jetta back in Canada first days of Feb next year. Standard height so I don't expect them to fail and they look decent with some flex built in with the black and red PSU molds.

Probably going to try the PSB on the tt arms and see how it goes. I won't be using the car much so if they fail I'll probably go back to stock R32/tt/LCR solid Bush.

Cheers for your input.

No worries, i used Cookbot inserts and a polybush on the front which are excellent, and then standard bushes on the rear. so far so good.

 

[Manny14]

To be honest, and this might not be very popular, I can't say I've noticed a massive difference in handling with the polybushes. I think the biggest impact I've had was when I changed the rear beam bushes for polybushes, and even the cheaper ones made the car feel much more planted, but the fronts I can't say I noticed as big a difference as I'd hoped. I was hoping for everything to feel really solid, but while the steering felt less sloppy, that could have been because I changed the ball joints at the same time. I haven't noticed any issues with ride being any more harsh though, and the car's still plenty comfortable while also handling well.

That said, I've not driven much this year what with Covid and everything, and I haven't had much of a chance to give the car a real shakedown after changing the front and rear shock absorbers as well.

I'll be putting in a rear ARB next week, and I've heard that makes the biggest impact, so it might be a matter of saving money by using the OEM bushes and putting the money you've saved towards a rear ARB?

Has the rear ARB made a difference?

 

[iammooks]

Has the rear ARB made a difference?

A massive difference.

In terms of the handling on my car, only two mods I've done have noticeably improved things - the first was changing the rear beam bushes to polybushes, which made the rear feel much more planted and solid. It's worth mentioning my old bushes were really bad and made the rear end feel like it was totally disconnected from the car, so keep that in mind. The other thing was the rear ARB. Every time I take the car out on a b-road or anything remotely twisty, I'm feathering the throttle to try and get it to step out, and it just stays planted. I don't even have especially good tyres on there - just Bridgestone Turanzas - but I'm yet to find the point where they lose traction, and believe me, I'm trying.

My feelings now that I've had some time to think about it is that on the mk1 Leon, the front is actually pretty good, but it's the rear end that needs attention. Being a front wheel drive car, it's at an obvious disadvantage, but the rear ARB does a really good job of cancelling most of that out. It's much more confidence-inspiring with the ARB especially, and I enjoy driving the car so much more now.

If I were to do anything else, I'd probably lower it a sensible amount, just to bring the centre of gravity down a bit. My only concern there would be scraping the sump as on my TDI it's already quite low. It's a shame I just replaced my shocks because I could have done that then, but I didn't have the money to do that, as is always the way.

 

[Manny14]

A massive difference.

In terms of the handling on my car, only two mods I've done have noticeably improved things - the first was changing the rear beam bushes to polybushes, which made the rear feel much more planted and solid. It's worth mentioning my old bushes were really bad and made the rear end feel like it was totally disconnected from the car, so keep that in mind. The other thing was the rear ARB. Every time I take the car out on a b-road or anything remotely twisty, I'm feathering the throttle to try and get it to step out, and it just stays planted. I don't even have especially good tyres on there - just Bridgestone Turanzas - but I'm yet to find the point where they lose traction, and believe me, I'm trying.

My feelings now that I've had some time to think about it is that on the mk1 Leon, the front is actually pretty good, but it's the rear end that needs attention. Being a front wheel drive car, it's at an obvious disadvantage, but the rear ARB does a really good job of cancelling most of that out. It's much more confidence-inspiring with the ARB especially, and I enjoy driving the car so much more now.

If I were to do anything else, I'd probably lower it a sensible amount, just to bring the centre of gravity down a bit. My only concern there would be scraping the sump as on my TDI it's already quite low. It's a shame I just replaced my shocks because I could have done that then, but I didn't have the money to do that, as is always the way.

Looks like this is where I will be investing! Could you give us a quick run down on parts required?

 

[MoToJoJo]

A massive difference.

In terms of the handling on my car, only two mods I've done have noticeably improved things - the first was changing the rear beam bushes to polybushes, which made the rear feel much more planted and solid. It's worth mentioning my old bushes were really bad and made the rear end feel like it was totally disconnected from the car, so keep that in mind. The other thing was the rear ARB. Every time I take the car out on a b-road or anything remotely twisty, I'm feathering the throttle to try and get it to step out, and it just stays planted. I don't even have especially good tyres on there - just Bridgestone Turanzas - but I'm yet to find the point where they lose traction, and believe me, I'm trying.

My feelings now that I've had some time to think about it is that on the mk1 Leon, the front is actually pretty good, but it's the rear end that needs attention. Being a front wheel drive car, it's at an obvious disadvantage, but the rear ARB does a really good job of cancelling most of that out. It's much more confidence-inspiring with the ARB especially, and I enjoy driving the car so much more now.

If I were to do anything else, I'd probably lower it a sensible amount, just to bring the centre of gravity down a bit. My only concern there would be scraping the sump as on my TDI it's already quite low. It's a shame I just replaced my shocks because I could have done that then, but I didn't have the money to do that, as is always the way.

You've got to really push it. I've got mine moving about but I was throwing it about like I stole it.

And +1 on the front being pretty good, soon as you get the inherent understeer dialled out anyway.

Oh, and should I mention I've got a set of H&R lowering springs available that I put less than 4000 miles on before I went for the coilovers?

 

[iammooks]

Looks like this is where I will be investing! Could you give us a quick run down on parts required?

If you get a new one, all the hardware should be included - from the brackets to the bolts. For my H&R one, I had to get some Mikalor Supra heavy duty clamps (97-104mm) to attach it to my rear beam but I could use my lower shock bolts without any trouble. Whiteline bars are adjustable and need longer bolts.

You've got to really push it. I've got mine moving about but I was throwing it about like I stole it.

And +1 on the front being pretty good, soon as you get the inherent understeer dialled out anyway.

Oh, and should I mention I've got a set of H&R lowering springs available that I put less than 4000 miles on before I went for the coilovers?

Are you saying you've got springs available? How much drop did you get with them? I keep reading that if you lower our cars too much, you're going to hit the sump on speed bumps?


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[Connor H]

If you get a new one, all the hardware should be included - from the brackets to the bolts. For my H&R one, I had to get some Mikalor Supra heavy duty clamps (97-104mm) to attach it to my rear beam but I could use my lower shock bolts without any trouble. Whiteline bars are adjustable and need longer bolts.



Are you saying you've got springs available? How much drop did you get with them? I keep reading that if you lower our cars too much, you're going to hit the sump on speed bumps?


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only after about 50-60mm

 

[MoToJoJo]

Are you saying you've got springs available? How much drop did you get with them? I keep reading that if you lower our cars too much, you're going to hit the sump on speed bumps?

Yup, I have. They're a 35mm max drop, you can see them on Euro Car Parts. Had them on for one year (3,626 miles according to the MoT history).

With speed humps I was always nervous of the sump so with the narrow ones I'd offset so it was one wheel going over, and the full width ones I'd just take it easy. Never had an issue.

In all honesty, for the price they do the job. It's not the most refined ride but then I've been spoiled by my KWs.

 

[jcth1]

So last week I ended up fitting the following parts to my Jetta back in Toronto.

PSB mk4 pressed arms kit
PSB 21mm ARB bushes
Flowflex ARB droplink bushes
Brand new Meyle golf inner and outer tie rods


It feels so much nicer to drive. The front end now tells you where it is and what it's up to. Just gotta sort the dogbone mount as 1 bolt snapped, new strut topmounts and bearings.

Then front brace, rear ARB, maybe a TT rack and solid bush and maybe a 1.9tdi swap in the summer

With 16 inch steelies on and winter tyres the car still flops around a lot but at standard height and with said wheels it does feel better.

Let's see how Toronto's roads treat those new bushes. I'm going to purchase a set for my Leon and the TT arms I have.