This is what a stage 2 1.4TSI truthfully makes

ibizacupra

Jack-RIP my little Friend
Jul 25, 2001
31,333
19
glos.uk
no idea who mike is. thats my personal experience of using 5 separate dyno dynamics(alan jeffreys, JKM, Surrey rolling road, Sanspeed and IAM Motorsport) rollers on numerous occasions and always being within a couple Hp/lbft of each other. Yet ive used AMDs on 3 occasions and have had vastly differing results each time with zero changes to the car.

be happy with your DD figure, but dont be conned into they are the most accurate dyno's because thats laughable

only measure atw figures dude and then add a % to get a flywheel figure, taking into account nothing about rolling losses between vehicles, which varies a lot..
 

mardon

Feel the DIFFerence
Sep 22, 2008
2,599
2
A bean bag
Interesting read!

I can certainly feel a difference between mode B and C higher up the rev range. I dont run it anymore as i've had the CEL a few times. Just waiting for it to show up when the ECU is read so I can get the revised injectors.

Were these figures at the fly?
 

GrDuDe_Cupra

Active Member
May 11, 2010
234
0
Ive not said that 230hp cant be achieved, i said it cant be achieved at stage 2.

stage 1 has no requirements.
Stage 2 requirements are a performance downpipe and that is it. The downpipe is required to not only improve flow but reduce EGTs. The cat back is just a small benefit over the DP.
Stage 2+ requirements are an intake, full exhaust and intercooler (sometimes a HPFP)
stage 3 is hybrids, or turbo upgrades
stage 4 is turbo upgrades and cam upgrades


QUOTE]

So in other words you need hybrid to get 230, ok fair enough cos i got 232bhp without a very streched file and with catalyst and ofc stock turbine. No point continue, man to its own beliefs.
 

dera

Guest
sorry my wrong i just spoke to my mechanic it was 280bhp and the car had camshaft and methanol but stock turbine.

Stock turbine, but what about the compressor wheel?

Stock compressor wheel is fully stalled when you have the airflow to produce 280hp from a 20VT.
K03 compressor wheel stalls from the tip and it starts at around 195 grams per second.

Its just the laws of physics.

You can get 280hp from a K03 20VT, but the turbo only limits the power then and what you have is a N/A car with a turbo limiting the intake airflow.
 

dera

Guest
So in other words you need hybrid to get 230, ok fair enough cos i got 232bhp without a very streched file and with catalyst and ofc stock turbine. No point continue, man to its own beliefs.

You got 232hp with the standard turbo?

You do realise you need over 300'000rpm to achieve that?

Man to its own beliefs, true.
 

chuckb

Mo bark n' Mo grunt
Apr 4, 2010
1,083
0
Sunny Slough
One word of caution I'd add to these kinds of thread are that whilst manufacturing tolerances are MUCH better than they used to be, no 2 cars are going to put down like for like figures, even with the same engine type as:

1) Each car may be adapted to it's own daily drive style
2) Engines are not blue-printed, hence will have differences in real world performance. I had two LCR225's from new, and they felt different power wise (nearly 10% from bum dyno). I always felt the first car was never 100%, but revisions in part numbers and state of 'run in' can all affect the numbers, as can the state of yor hardware (coil packs wearing for instance!)
3) Even over a 10k service life cycle you can see a reduction in performance at the tail end of the service cycle compared to a recently serviced car. Bad fuel can accentuate this.

Also I've never been a great believer that dyno numbers translate to a great drive. Whilst they are a useful tool to support the process of defining the effectiveness of your modification upgrade path, or to diagnose / healthcheck your car, once you put the car back on the road under 'normal' operating conditions these figures are almost 'by the by'.

A driver who has advanced skills and decent training or track experience can drive around the odd few bhp of difference.

Lets be clear, at 225bhp, even if the figures are out by 10bhp, that is less than 5%, and it's questionnable you are going to feel that through the seat of your pants unless your sister was the princess featured in the book 'The Princess and the Pea'!

As the man says no two cars are the same, plus have a pea under the covers is as the girl said in the advert for Sky "Perverrrse"

Any way I read all this dyno waving and heres my 50p worth


You can dyno and RR till the cows come home, I always think its all a bit too "male masculine" a bit like how high can you pee up the wall at school. The remap gives you the edge over others in the daily drive world, to me that is more important, the bit of oomph gets you out of the odd sticky situation and from a to b quicker when you need to.

I agree with Mr Shelby or Mr Ferrari

It was believed to be said by Enzo Ferrari, maybe Carroll Shelby, maybe both, that "Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races", well, I happen to believe that for the most part..

If in fact this is so, why does everyone get so caught up on peak HP numbers, but yet very rarely does anyone ever talk about torque, or torque curve??

Over to the Hp Meisters!
 

chuckb

Mo bark n' Mo grunt
Apr 4, 2010
1,083
0
Sunny Slough
Sadly mate no, we drive lil ole 1.4 "mums shopping trolley cars on steroids with a large dose of viagra"

Even my Mk1 RS Focus only just makes it to the 200bhp plus bragging ponies club.

Couple of times I have thought, well its only a 1.4 what do I expect?
 

jc_boc

Missing the CUPRA R!
Jul 18, 2008
9,304
7
Desborough
LOL, this thread has turned into a war zone! I really didn't think it would get out of hand like this. It is interesting to read all the theories and responses though, so once again, I will make it VERY clear. I am VERY HAPPY with my cars performance and can not fault REVO at all. i was merely surprised at the results on the rollers versus what was claimed. Can heat soak really cost me around 25HP? I know nothing bout these sort of things but I seriously doubt it tbh.
 

chuckb

Mo bark n' Mo grunt
Apr 4, 2010
1,083
0
Sunny Slough
Jase is right. It may rattle it make drink oil like a tramp with a can of Special Brew on a Saturday night. But it is quick and it does make me smile, I had an experience with a newish Golf GTI on Saturday evening, I think he was genuinely shocked when we got to the roundabout.

Its all about the real world for me!
 

jc_boc

Missing the CUPRA R!
Jul 18, 2008
9,304
7
Desborough
Exactly and trust me on the road when I put my foot down this car is out the gates like a greyhound at the track after the bunny.
 

dera

Guest
LOL, this thread has turned into a war zone! I really didn't think it would get out of hand like this. It is interesting to read all the theories and responses though, so once again, I will make it VERY clear. I am VERY HAPPY with my cars performance and can not fault REVO at all. i was merely surprised at the results on the rollers versus what was claimed. Can heat soak really cost me around 25HP? I know nothing bout these sort of things but I seriously doubt it tbh.

If heat soak was a problem, you would've seen 220-230hp at the first run, then slowly going down to what your result was in the end.

Heat soak does not cause that kind of losses on the first run, unless it was +35C outside and you had your car idling for a few hours.

(I'm not commenting anything about your remap though, just saying what the facts are, and commenting on mr. 230hp stock turbo's comments...)
 

jc_boc

Missing the CUPRA R!
Jul 18, 2008
9,304
7
Desborough
:lol: If I was going to keep this car I would have slapped the twintercooler and intake kit on mine. Damn this uncertainty of not knowing if the engine will be changed next year or not!
 

dera

Guest
And yes, its all about driveability, real life performance, and like Revo Kev said, "area under the curve".
 

chuckb

Mo bark n' Mo grunt
Apr 4, 2010
1,083
0
Sunny Slough
:lol: If I was going to keep this car I would have slapped the twintercooler and intake kit on mine. Damn this uncertainty of not knowing if the engine will be changed next year or not!

Same, Forge would have got some of my hard earned for the twintercooler to go with my intake kit. But as its going by December or early January Im loathe to spend out more on it, Lots of new designs and cars coming out next year. Typical just when the Rocco was looking good and along comes a gaggle of new hatch backs!

Dammit :D:lol:
 
Lecatona HPFP (High-pressure Fuel Pump Upgrades)