Spare Wheel removal

[godber225r]

I had no choice one of my wheels were broken and i had to use it. Now i dont have a spare!! i have tyreweld there instead temparelaly till i can find another one.

I have used it too, when we had all the snow. It does work its good stuff but i would definatley recommend taking a plug in compressor with you too as the tyreweld does not have that much air in it and when it was finished the tyre was barely inflated.

 

[Nef]

So do I, 17" wheels with 15" spare (how it comes from factory) but the RR is the same, if you have gone that different with your wheels then speedo etc will be out etc.

at the moment my wheels are 18" with a 35 profile tyre.

 

[MrBen2k7]

It is definitely a condition of my breakdown insurance that I must carry a spare wheel.

same here

 

[Gordz]

DO NOT RELY COMPLETELY ON TYRE WELD STUFF!!!

I learnt the hard way last year I think it was on the M56 I got a puncture (at 70+ it was a very brown pants moment!), pulled over and thought fine I've got tyre weld I'll just pop that in and everything will be fine... no... the type of puncture it was the tyre weld just wouldn't work on it.

Had to get towed to nearest tyre place, and cheapest tyre the thieving kwik fit scum suposedly had was something like £80 or £90 for a BUDGET tyre!!!!!!!!! So I had to fork out for that and lost 3 or 4 hours of my life!!!!!

And since then, i ALWAYS keep spare wheel in, no matter how much weight it saves!!!

 

[Andrewcupra TDI]

the only thing to do id replace your tyres with run flats

and then ditch the spare ,

but for the extra money is it worth it ,

to save weight dont carry aload of crap in the boot ( like i do )

can also stip out sound deadening if you looking to shave a few pounds

 

[MrBen2k7]

Run flats are heavier tyres aren't they?

My dad had them in his 5 series, ruined the handling. Made it really stiff.

 

[leonrob]

the only thing to do id replace your tyres with run flats

and then ditch the spare ,

but for the extra money is it worth it ,

to save weight dont carry aload of crap in the boot ( like i do )

can also stip out sound deadening if you looking to shave a few pounds

runflats are very heavy so it will if anything add weight overall even with the spair taken out .
My old car didnt have a spair and in two years i gt one puncture i called a friend and he took me to the nearest scrappy and i bought a wheel (with tyre) for £10 put it on and drove home i was lucky cause i wasent far from someone i knew bt i allways carry one now .

 

[JamJay]

My breakdown cover wants me to have a spare wheel also, just as well I got the 5th LCR wheel refurbed in the same colour as the rest

 

[Gordz]

Run flats are heavier tyres aren't they?

My dad had them in his 5 series, ruined the handling. Made it really stiff.

Yeah my dad has a 5 series estate and it came with run flats, handling is brilliant, but the ride can get quite harsh over rough roads as there's just no give in the tyre at all.

 

[Seat Gooner]

well i get the vibe from this convo as its not a good idea

but then again if you dont wonder then you wouldnt do anything

Ive heard about the run flats are rubbish

 

[Andrewcupra TDI]

been driving my unlces cooper S , and thought handling was superb eith runflats

also his 330msport esetate is very firm & comfy

even my lil sis's 120d bm is a comfy ride , they all have runflats ,

if you have uprated suspension then your used to stiff ride anyways

personally im leaving mine as is , altho i may look at getting a 5th alloy as the thing i got is not quite a space saver its pretty wide , just has a 50mph limit on it ????


ive seen some reallly thin ones , ive ate thicker choclate digestives

 

[Slimy]

I don't have a spare at the moment, the previous owner fitted Cupra wheels but decided to bin the spare instead of risk having unmatched tyres. I have a couple of tins of tyreweld instead. When I did get a puncture, I was lucky enough to get it to work, and get a local garage out to fit a new tyre. I doubt I'll be that lucky next time. I am keeping an eye out for a new spare, but with the big discs on the front it needs to be a 16 inch wheel minimum, which is challenging to find as a single wheel.

Recovery companies do consider tyreweld to be an appropriate replacement for a spare wheel, even if it doesn't actually work...

 

[Seat Gooner]

been driving my unlces cooper S , and thought handling was superb eith runflats

also his 330msport esetate is very firm & comfy

even my lil sis's 120d bm is a comfy ride , they all have runflats ,

if you have uprated suspension then your used to stiff ride anyways

personally im leaving mine as is , altho i may look at getting a 5th alloy as the thing i got is not quite a space saver its pretty wide , just has a 50mph limit on it ????


ive seen some reallly thin ones , ive ate thicker choclate digestives

thats a good point could we swap a spare 18" alloy for a donut wheel (50mph Wheel)

 

[Nautilus]

1. A 16 inch steel spare wheel plus tyre for a Leon Mk 1 has about 18 kg (39.7 lbs). The toolbox which is tightly strapped to the wheel has about 5 kg more. That is a 23 kg weight or 1,6% of the entire car weight.

2. However, the spare wheel may serve 2 more purposes in a street running Leon.

First purpose is weight balancing. A Leon Mk 1 has a weight distribution around 57:43 with driver and some fuel, which is not close enough to the ideal 50:50, and removal of weight from the rear disturbs the ratio. In fact, this is the fault of most family-car based GTIs: the original chassis had been designed to run with 4 people and some grocery bags inside, so it approaches 50:50 only when both front and rear seats are occupied.

Second purpose is less understood, but a 23 kg weight which has an elastic point of contact with the chassis (sits on the tyre rubber) is more or less a tuned mass damper.

So the vertical oscillation of the weight under road shocks provides a sort of damping effect and lessens vibration around the rear axle. (This may be the point for which manufactures fit the spare wheel so low, behind and below axle center, and fit it with a mounting screw.)

Using a smartphone taped to the boot floor and a specialized application can provide some ground to calculate the natural frequency of the Leon body and therefore the characteristics of the tuned mass damper to compensate. (It's somewhere in the 16 Hz range.)

3. For the above reasons, tried to compensate the unpleasant jarring motion in the rear bodywork which appeared when running over multiple small ruts and cracks in the tarmac (it escapes the damping ability of the Koni FSDs for some reason. With stock or harder shock absorbers it becomes worse).

Fixed the toolbox as tight as possible to the spare wheel, so they comprised a single mass, strengthened the mounting screw by filling it with epoxy cement, loosened it progressively to allow the spare wheel to oscillate and tested on the same stretch of road.

After some attempts, there was a "sweet spot" where the vertical motion of the spare wheel compensated for the vertical motion of the rear bodywork and therefore the ride quality was improved.

 

[Nautilus]

There are a multitude of patents involving the mounting of the spare tyre on an elastic pivot to use it as a tuned mass damper:

US Patent 3724731A - Wheel Carrier Holdings Pty Ltd, 1973

US Patent Application 20060108489 - Timothy E. Nauman et al., 2006

US Patent 7882993 - GM, 2007

US Patent 7837075 - Toyota, 2007

US Patent 8550315 - Chrysler, 2008

The 1973 and (Toyota 2007) patents are closest in shape and function to what we can do on a compact car with a vertical pivot for the spare wheel.

 

[David McMahon]

I've never seen a car with an inflated spare! I turned my BMW one upside down so I can check the pressure easier (but lose the plastic tray)

 

[Bouncerbeater]

All seems a bit pointless on a road car. You could lose more weight by laying off the pies for a few months. Well, some members on here, me included
Lose a couple more on that long walk when you get stranded miles from civilisation too

 

[Nautilus]

For handling, weight added in the rear and as low as possible (below the stock height of the center of gravity) serves 5 purposes:

1. moves the center of gravity slightly rearwards.

2. being outside the wheelbase, changes the polar moment of inertia in tight curves.

3. prevents rear end rise under braking (TT Mk 1s post 2000 recall have a 27lbs steel ballast in the rear bumper).

4. lowers the center of gravity slightly.

5. dampens the rear end up-down vibration on rough roads.

Only #5 needs a slightly movable ballast (spare wheel or toolbox on an elastic mount).

By removing weight from the front outside the wheelbase (move small, non-essential parts rearwards, or use lightweight battery and other parts) and adding weight in the rear outside the wheelbase (solid anti-roll bar, toolboxes, heavier exhaust muffler and so on), all 5 purposes are fulfilled.

Also, aerodynamic mods to the front (undertray below engine, air deflectors before front wheels and so on) also generate some front end aero lift. Not as dramatic as **** Shine's Golf Mk4 suspension, where the front is raised almost 2 inches compared to rear (and it looks like a lame duck). But still some lift.

All these small mods combined give better handling. At the cost of increasing the car's weight by a small amount. Not enough to hurt. The weight difference from a 2WD 1.8T LFR to a 4WD 1.9TDI LC is much greater, nearly a quarter-ton, and still barely hurts straight-line acceleration. Not the weight that bothers you, but the place where it is. We need it as low and as backwards as possible.

People start lightening the car by removing stuff from the rear. In practice, we need the opposite, remove it from the front, to bring the nose-heavy chassis of the Leon back into balance.

 

[Andrewwright]

Not much to remove from the front though. Agree though that weight does need to stay in the back. Very twitchy at speed if you let off round a bend. I'm Going to fit a cage into it at some point to put some weight back in the back and for safety tbh. battery in the boot and air con removal is very all you can take out isn't it.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

 

[Nautilus]

Eibach 25mm rear anti-roll bar is 8kg (17.6lbs) and fits very low on the rear axle. 28-32 mm bars may be much heavier.

Stock 1.8T muffler is heavy. Supersprint mufflers are smaller in volume, but even heavier.

A moderately sized toolbox is about 5kgs (11lbs). We need one. Modded cars running high temps kill hoses, wires and rubber parts in the engine bay.

In front: use lightweight battery, saves about 6kg (13lbs) and is smaller, moves the remaining lbs 2 inches lower and 2 inches backwards. Leave the washer fluid tank empty, saves 3-5 kg (7-11lbs). Each pound removed from front counts just as one added in the back.

Center of gravity on a stock 1.8T Leon Cupra is about 23 inches (58 cm) from ground. Measured by a fellow member of this forum. Lowering the car 1 inch drops the center of gravity 0.8 inch. Moving weight downwards drops it further.

Juggling with lightweight parts front, toolboxes and other ballast rear, weight distribution can be changed by more than 50kg (110lbs) rearwards.

What to avoid:

- factory sunroof cars. Too much weight up. Two Golf Mk6s otherwise identical had shown more than 20 lbs difference. Two Golf Rs otherwise identical had shown an insane 45 lbs difference in weight!

- Dynamat on roof. Melts and drips under summer temps, adds 5lbs or more weight up.

- factory electric seat cars. Electric seats are uselessly heavy and this weight is towards the front.

A guy with autocross experience said: "BMW did the huge expense of using carbon fiber roofs on M3 CSLs and carbon fiber cam covers on the 320si - they knew 15 lbs shaven from the wrong place count more than 100 lbs in the right place! "