Robbie C's Ibiza Cupra

[ibizacupra]

some more..

now installed, bores honed, there were quite a lot of scores on there (poor filtration in its life perhaps)
calico coated bearings fitted to it also


just cleaning up sump and cleaned out the oil pick up pipe which had sump sealer debris in it, and noticed the baffle plate was cracked thru the weld

preheated the sump and welded it up again now. no cracks now.
off to glue it back in place again next

l8trs

 

[Robbie C]

wow, thanks for being so thorough here Bill and picking up on these points. Makes me glad I left it with you.

Is the cylinder scoring anything to be worried about?

I'm guessing with the bores being honed I may as well let you fill it with your own oil if it'll need changing after a few miles to flush out any swarf?

 

[Ibiza125]

Any more updates Rob/Bill?

 

[Robbie C]

Bill's been off sick lately so I don't think there's any major updates for the time being, though the rods and pistons are now in

He's also waiting on me for the time being as I've now sent back my old tubular manifold to JBS who have, finally, agreed to replace this with one of their new cast models.

After already seeing one in the flesh at Bill's workshop and comparing the relative design strengthes against my INA manifold I've decided to have my new JBS mani sent direct to Bill so he can swap this over while the head is still off, making it the best time to do it

I was initially just going to sell it to try and get my money back on it but it would appear to be much higher quality than my INA manifold, with more careful consideration regarding port sharing and runner diameter to maximise efficiency. If there's anymore to be had out of my car then I'm game It will be interesting to see if it makes any real world difference as such.

I'm also having a larger (3 quart) WMI tank fitted to replace my existing one as it's simply not big enough if I'm going out for a long blast. I've been out of the country all week and I think Bill's also been away so next week will hopefully see some more progress once this manifold arrives

 

[cupramillo]

When i saw the new JBS manifold it just oozed quality. Bit gutted it was available to buy after i bought my INA one as the JBS one looks ALOT better in so many ways over the INA manifold.

So after your mani is fitted and WMI installed is that project over Robbie? Dont think there is much else you can do now without going BT

 

[Ibiza125]

What else are you getting done at the same time as the rods Rob? I was thinking of doing mine myself and just wandering what else Bill advised to go with.

 

[Robbie C]

When i saw the new JBS manifold it just oozed quality. Bit gutted it was available to buy after i bought my INA one as the JBS one looks ALOT better in so many ways over the INA manifold.

So after your mani is fitted and WMI installed is that project over Robbie? Dont think there is much else you can do now without going BT

Yeah I know what you mean - the only reason I went with INA was to get my car back together and ready for mapping as I didn't fancy the Kinetic manifold after hearing about Benny's cracking twice and knew I couldn't rely on waiting for the JBS to become available. Will be difficult for me to compare as I think Bill is going to play with my map anyway with the rods now in to see if there's any more torque to be had.

Yeah I think the car is near enough "finished" for me now, in the loose sense of the word anyway To be honest I have to draw a line somewhere, I've spent a LOT of money on it now that I'm not going to see again so I may as well spend some time just enjoying it

There is a small voice in my head saying I should have just gone BT and truth be told I'm still not sure whether I've made the right choices or not, though I know I do love the instant kick that the hybrid gives which I might miss if I went BT. Still hard for me to comment really when I've not even driven mine in the dry yet to see what it's really got to give.

What else are you getting done at the same time as the rods Rob? I was thinking of doing mine myself and just wandering what else Bill advised to go with.

I asked Bill about this and he said unless I wanted to go silly power in the future I didn't need to bother with the added expense of pistons etc; if I was going to do that then I'd really have to go proper BT to justify it.

I always said to myself I was going to draw the line at internals but yet here I am...

I'm not sure how much more power I could run on standard valves and pistons but imagine it still gives me scope for the mid-300s if I really did get the itch - we'll see!

 

[Ibiza125]

I asked Bill about this and he said unless I wanted to go silly power in the future I didn't need to bother with the added expense of pistons etc; if I was going to do that then I'd really have to go proper BT to justify it.

I always said to myself I was going to draw the line at internals but yet here I am...

I'm not sure how much more power I could run on standard valves and pistons but imagine it still gives me scope for the mid-300s if I really did get the itch - we'll see!

I was meaning like pins and stuff? What bearings and gaskets you need and any other parts in the engine that he is changing. Would probably be best giving him a PM

 

[Robbie C]

Oh I see! Not sure exactly what else Bill's used other than the details he's posted in here tbh - i.e. the calico coated bearings. New head gasket would also be a fairly obvious one. My rocker cover gasket is sub 1000 miles old so not sure that'll need replacing again in this instance. Other than that, new piston rings and cylinder bores re-honed to my knowledge.

I got a quote from Alex at BDM who quoted for new rings, big end bearings, head skim with new valve stem seals, guides (if needed), and valves re-seated but not sure how much of this Bill has deemed necessary on mine.

 

[barnsley]

ya bills up scotland on his hols think hes due back soon

 

[jamiebennett81]

When i saw the new JBS manifold it just oozed quality. Bit gutted it was available to buy after i bought my INA one as the JBS one looks ALOT better in so many ways over the INA manifold.

So after your mani is fitted and WMI installed is that project over Robbie? Dont think there is much else you can do now without going BT

So did the last one, looked nice and look what happened to that? Also shiny manifolds on eBay look nice but they are poor quality

it may look nice or ooze quality but the proof is in the pudding so as of right now, I am still very sceptical, hence I asked for my money back and didn't want a replacement....

 

[cupramillo]

Personally i think JBS have learned their lesson and wont make the same mistake twice, but we will just have to wait and see. Im going to give it 4-5months and wait and see how people get on with theirs and then decide to buy one or not.

First looks are though that it looks quality and alot better built than the last one.

 

[cupramillo]

Robbie, you know your intercooler pipework, am i right in saying that it will only mate up with a pro-alloy intercooler? Also, does the ebay pipework kit include the pipes for changing the position of the charge pipe to where the LCR one is situated?

thanks dude

 

[Robbie C]

I know what JB is saying about the manifold but having seen one in the flesh and based upon Bill's own comments (though he wisely reserves full judgement until it's fitted and RR'ed on Mrs B's Lupo) it would seem a much better casting than the likes of the INA/THS with much more design consideration. It's a risk I grant you, but while the head is still off and the map is being tweaked anyway then it makes sense to do it now if I'm going to do it at all.

Robbie, you know your intercooler pipework, am i right in saying that it will only mate up with a pro-alloy intercooler? Also, does the ebay pipework kit include the pipes for changing the position of the charge pipe to where the LCR one is situated?

thanks dude

Yes and no The pipework was made up from a generic ebay kit and a further 3 hard aluminium 90 degree bends to minimise the amount of silicone used.

The ebay kit was all that was needed to change the charge pipe route to match that of the LCR yes. Only minor modifications would be needed to make my fit other intercoolers as it will still have to mate up to the end tanks at more or less the same level so you could use mine as a broad template if that's what you're getting at - though my end tanks are angled to aid smooth air flow and minimise any steep bends. Also bear in mind that I am not using an off-the-shelf Pro Alloy cooler, I had them fabricate a custom FMIC based upon a replica of the A+M Motorsport intercooler.

The only thing to watch out for with the ebay kits is that the pipes are not beaded (and there's no point when you end up chopping them to size) so I'm also getting Bill to bead roll them with a tool he has in the workshop to ensure I don't have any hoses popping off under boost

 

[jamiebennett81]

I know what JB is saying about the manifold but having seen one in the flesh and based upon Bill's own comments (though he wisely reserves full judgement until it's fitted and RR'ed on Mrs B's Lupo) it would seem a much better casting than the likes of the INA/THS with much more design consideration. It's a risk I grant you, but while the head is still off and the map is being tweaked anyway then it makes sense to do it now if I'm going to do it at all.

true, but you get what you pay for, and with the INA one at £200, if it does the job, then I am happy

maybe the pub talk figures for the JBS one will give more, but I always weigh up the cost difference i.e. JBS Vs INA in this case into how it transfers that difference on the road, and if it gave another 5-10bhp on the road, still for me, the money on the INA one has been well spent because in a straight line speed, with that sort of marginal difference, will be barely noticeable

in defence of INA, he has taken the standard cast product, reworked it, and offers a nice upgrade for a very very good cost (mind you so did THS and failed, but so far INA's one is holding up). Sure, its not as pretty, but then who cares, its stuck at the back of the engine where its barely seen

 

[stupac]

nice car and spec mate, where did you get your powder coating done? looks really good

 

[Robbie C]

true, but you get what you pay for, and with the INA one at £200, if it does the job, then I am happy

maybe the pub talk figures for the JBS one will give more, but I always weigh up the cost difference i.e. JBS Vs INA in this case into how it transfers that difference on the road, and if it gave another 5-10bhp on the road, still for me, the money on the INA one has been well spent because in a straight line speed, with that sort of marginal difference, will be barely noticeable

in defence of INA, he has taken the standard cast product, reworked it, and offers a nice upgrade for a very very good cost (mind you so did THS and failed, but so far INA's one is holding up). Sure, its not as pretty, but then who cares, its stuck at the back of the engine where its barely seen

Valid point on the cost, though not sure how INA have re-worked it?

From the pics I've seen of the THS manifold they look very similar to me... so much so you could almost suspect they're imported from the same Chinese manufacturer or similar...

It's not so much about power gains as it is about efficiency gains - smaller, yet consistent diameter runners for faster spooling capability and a collector that ensures the exhaust gases aren't colliding with each other - all aiding flow into the turbo. The quality of the casting itself also looks to be much higher than that of the INA.

At the end of the day I just want to ensure that I'm running the highest performing and reliable parts that I can, and curiosity is getting the better of me on this one

 

[Robbie C]

nice car and spec mate, where did you get your powder coating done? looks really good

Thanks Those parts were actually wet sprayed in the end by a place that refurbishs wheels but I can't recommend them as they couldn't be bothered to mask off the areas that weren't meant to be sprayed - i.e. the underside of the rocker cover

 

[ibizacupra]

removed ina manifold, which was poor fitment, caused by the drilling being offset so the access to 2 of the nuts was very difficult.. you can see the extent of the offset the bolt holes caused by the exhaust manifold gasket witness :thumbdown: Previous ina one i have fitted did not have this fitment issue, but did need the usual grinding off the top flange face.. erratic quality between batches from china perhaps.. who knows

JBS one lines up, although I have to reject one of the supplied mounting bolts for turbo as its rolled threads were "wonky" - new replacement should land tomoz

jbs manifold fits well
also have to replace a damaged stud which no doubt was caused during the ina manifold installation.

 

[Ibiza125]

Oh god... Not looking forward to fitting mine now...