Forge 008p DV - ARRIVED & FITTED!

[QU4RESMA]

It is quite a peice of work! Does the job and does it really well!

Got rid of that Splitter R - Finally!

However, whilst i was changing the spring for a yellow one, i noticed Forge provided me with 3 blanking plates the size of of a 10p coin... any ideas what these are for?

Many thanks!

 

[LEE69]

They are shims to increase the spring pressure slightly

 

[QU4RESMA]

Where do i fit this?

 

[LEE69]

Inside the dump valve, you take it apart.

 

[QU4RESMA]

Ye i took it apart to change springs, i'm using the yellow spring now.
Do i use 1 shim or more? and does it sit beneath the spring?

 

[x24sevenbikerx]

the shims are personal / what map . prefrence , im using the 008 and im just using the yellow spring on its own , its so you can get a 'stronger spring' without moving all the way to say the blue one etc

 

[t0m]

If you suffer with a flutter on full WOT in 4th particularly, try fit one of these shims.

All helps the dv setup with what boost you are running. Varies car to car.

 

[BEEFYGTI]

Im going to use a blanking disc I'm fluttering in 4th all the time ?

 

[Segger]

Sorry to hijack but what's the difference 008-007p? What I mean is which is better? Or is it just a newer version?

 

[x24sevenbikerx]

Sorry to hijack but what's the difference 008-007p? What I mean is which is better? Or is it just a newer version?

008 is the newer one , released not long ago , slight changes to it , there info on it in the forge section of the changes etc i think

 

[t0m]

Im going to use a blanking disc I'm fluttering in 4th all the time ?

Fluttering can come from the DV not opening correctly under boost... the shims have been known to help.

 

[QU4RESMA]

I was under the impression that fluttering occurs when the spring is too stiff/strong?
Can anyone clarify how and where the shims are meant to sit?

 

[8bit]

I was under the impression that fluttering occurs when the spring is too stiff/strong?
Can anyone clarify how and where the shims are meant to sit?

Open the valve, the shim goes inside the piston, under the spring.

I'm getting fluttering in 4th too, I have one shim plus yellow spring in my 008. Funny how I never got it until I fitted by B5 TIP, guess I'm just flowing a touch too much air now. Got another shim to try, if that fails I'll order a blue spring and try that.

I'm making about 23.5psi in 4th at WOT, Forge reckon yellow spring is good for up to about 23psi, I see peaks of a bit more than that in 2nd and 3rd so reckon blue spring might be the ideal one for me. That's just Revo stage 1 BTW, stage 2 folks should possibly all be on blue springs.

EDIT - we're talking about a different sort of fluttering. If you're getting fluttering sound on dump then it's cos your DV isn't opening, or is but not enough to allow charge air to release. What we're talking about here is fluttering sound when coming on full boost at wide-open throttle, this may be because the valve is getting pushed open slightly by the boost pressure.

 

[Allan_84]

Open the valve, the shim goes inside the piston, under the spring.

I'm getting fluttering in 4th too, I have one shim plus yellow spring in my 008. Funny how I never got it until I fitted by B5 TIP, guess I'm just flowing a touch too much air now. Got another shim to try, if that fails I'll order a blue spring and try that.

I'm making about 23.5psi in 4th at WOT, Forge reckon yellow spring is good for up to about 23psi, I see peaks of a bit more than that in 2nd and 3rd so reckon blue spring might be the ideal one for me. That's just Revo stage 1 BTW, stage 2 folks should possibly all be on blue springs.

EDIT - we're talking about a different sort of fluttering. If you're getting fluttering sound on dump then it's cos your DV isn't opening, or is but not enough to allow charge air to release. What we're talking about here is fluttering sound when coming on full boost at wide-open throttle, this may be because the valve is getting pushed open slightly by the boost pressure.

cant see the problem when doing WOT, there is the same pressure on both sides of the DV, the same pressure that is forcing the DV open is forcing it to stay closed, then the spring have an easy job and the spring dont need to be big.

remember the small vacum line from the DV is connected to the manifold, and if you have WOT the vacum line also see the same boost.
the spring tension have nothing to say when on WOT, its on part throttle you need the spring.

correct me if im wrong.

 

[t0m]

Open the valve, the shim goes inside the piston, under the spring.

I'm getting fluttering in 4th too, I have one shim plus yellow spring in my 008. Funny how I never got it until I fitted by B5 TIP, guess I'm just flowing a touch too much air now. Got another shim to try, if that fails I'll order a blue spring and try that.

I'm making about 23.5psi in 4th at WOT, Forge reckon yellow spring is good for up to about 23psi, I see peaks of a bit more than that in 2nd and 3rd so reckon blue spring might be the ideal one for me. That's just Revo stage 1 BTW, stage 2 folks should possibly all be on blue springs.

EDIT - we're talking about a different sort of fluttering. If you're getting fluttering sound on dump then it's cos your DV isn't opening, or is but not enough to allow charge air to release. What we're talking about here is fluttering sound when coming on full boost at wide-open throttle, this may be because the valve is getting pushed open slightly by the boost pressure.

8bit, I don't get the fluttering now and I run the yellow spring and NO shims in m 007p. It was serviced recently though with a new piston also.

The fluttering went when the B5 tip came off and the SFS one went on.

As far as I'm aware, blue is for cars running big turbo. Stage 2 psi shouldn't really go above the limits of the yellow spring unless there's a spike etc I'd have thought?

 

[8bit]

cant see the problem when doing WOT, there is the same pressure on both sides of the DV, the same pressure that is forcing the DV open is forcing it to stay closed, then the spring have an easy job and the spring dont need to be big.

remember the small vacum line from the DV is connected to the manifold, and if you have WOT the vacum line also see the same boost.
the spring tension have nothing to say when on WOT, its on part throttle you need the spring.

correct me if im wrong.

The boost on the DV doesn't push against the bottom of the piston, it's against the side (unless you run yours in "reverse"?). The piston on the 007 is heavily tapered at the bottom so my theory is that the boost may be pushing it enough to crack it open just a touch.

8bit, I don't get the fluttering now and I run the yellow spring and NO shims in m 007p. It was serviced recently though with a new piston also.

The fluttering went when the B5 tip came off and the SFS one went on.

As far as I'm aware, blue is for cars running big turbo. Stage 2 psi shouldn't really go above the limits of the yellow spring unless there's a spike etc I'd have thought?

See here - http://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/content.asp?inc=product&cat=&product=FMDVTUN

My boost spiked at 23.5 psi on the rollers recently, that was in 4th. That works out about 1.6bar and I get spikes of about 1.7 or 1.8 in 2nd and 3rd, so from what Forge say on that page I'd reckon blue is probably more like it.

It's possible that the B5 TIP flows a touch more air than the SFS so on certain configurations of map, intercoolers, exhaust and air filter/feed you'd get flutter on the B5 TIP but not the SFS one. I know of one guy locally who says he gets flutter on both, he had the B5 V1 TIP before the SFS.

What I'll say as a disclaimer to both of you is that of course I could be completely wrong I tried an HKS SSQV dump valve last night, the design of this valve makes it impossible for boost pressure to force it open. I got no flutter at all, so this to me suggests that my own DV is what's responsible for the flutter in my case.

 

[Allan_84]

The boost on the DV doesn't push against the bottom of the piston, it's against the side (unless you run yours in "reverse"?). The piston on the 007 is heavily tapered at the bottom so my theory is that the boost may be pushing it enough to crack it open just a touch.

i know what you mean:

what you call side i still call bottom, the piston can only go up or down, so its stil affecting the bottom side of the piston, yes? but anyway.

but remember the area inside the piston is equal as big or bigger. and the inside have boost pressure also (the small vacum line, remember), then the force from the boost pipe on the outer ring of the piston cant be bigger then the inside, you see what i mean. all the inside of the piston where the spring is on the piston is also under boost.

i had a forge 007 but fitted an APR R1 insted, now i dont have to service/maintain the DV any more, and dont need to change spings.

 

[8bit]

I see what you mean but remember that the hose from the charge pipe is much larger than the one from the N249 (or intake manifold if you have bypassed the N249). So this means that the boost is going to hit the side (or bottom) of the piston before it hits the top.

In a situation where your boost is on or close to the limit of what the spring is rated for then I can see it's possible that you get this fluttering - boost pushes the piston open slightly causing air to escape, this causes the piston to close. Boost rises again and pushes the piston open again, and so on.

Like I said, maybe I am wrong. I'll hopefully be able to try my valve with another shim in tomorrow.