1St week in a 2023 VZ2

[CosmicBlue]

I guess it is inevitable that after 3 Audi RSQ3 I'll draw comparisons between the two vehicles.....strangely perhaps the 300 pony Ateca is the Q3 that Audi never made, it would have been an SQ3 but that never happened.

The Ateca has features that the F3 Q3 has never had like a memory drivers seat or the reverse camera with a washer jet. The virtual cockpit being very configurable is waaay better too.

I'm impressed, it drives well, ride quality is excellent and it handles way better than a tall SUV ought to (it is nearly 50mm taller than the RS), and decently quick too. Actual real-world (ignoring the fibbing trip computer) fuel consumption is 28mpg around town (similar to the RS) and 35.98mpg on a 200 mile round trip to Heathrow - better than one could reasonably expect.

The interior is a nice place to be and passengers have commented how comfortable it is, even in the back with lots of legroom. I know the Ateca is in its last year of production and will be replaced later this year, it does bear out the fact that it is fully sorted. I don't envisage regular trips to the dealer to get niggly stuff fixed and as I have retired now will probably keep this car a for while.

 

[H Rafiq]

Better than an RSQ3?

 

[CosmicBlue]

It's lot closer than you'd possibly think.

RSQ3 ownership is dominated by the 5 pot EA855 EVO engine, making around 420bhp/500Nm on 98 Octane fuel, has bags of character and a great sound. Even a base RSQ3 is around £60,000 GBP, add all the toys to get the VZ2/VZ3/VZN spec and you'll be knocking on the door of £75,000 GBP. It will eat fuel and tyres (15,000 miles for set of 4 - driven conservatively, some owners barely see 10k a set ).

Put the engine aside and the Ateca in 300 form is very nearly as quick on paper and feels so from the wheel too, it is staggeringly good value, came across this video of one blatting around the Nurburgring track at an indecent pace by someone who clearly knew the circuit really well,:

I note that there are many shared components in the suspension and drivetrain with an F3 Q3, same front discs as a 45 TFSI, same rear discs too and also fitted to RSQ3 on all years right back to 2014, looking underneath it all looks very familiar.

 

[Loadmaster748]

It's lot closer than you'd possibly think.

RSQ3 ownership is dominated by the 5 pot EA855 EVO engine, making around 420bhp/500Nm on 98 Octane fuel, has bags of character and a great sound. Even a base RSQ3 is around £60,000 GBP, add all the toys to get the VZ2/VZ3/VZN spec and you'll be knocking on the door of £75,000 GBP. It will eat fuel and tyres (15,000 miles for set of 4 - driven conservatively, some owners barely see 10k a set ).

Put the engine aside and the Ateca in 300 form is very nearly as quick on paper and feels so from the wheel too, it is staggeringly good value, came across this video of one blatting around the Nuremberg track at an indecent pace by someone who clearly knew the circuit really well,:

I note that there are many shared components in the suspension and drivetrain with an F3 Q3, same front discs as a 45 TFSI, same rear discs too and also fitted to RSQ3 on all years right back to 2014, looking underneath it all looks very familiar.

Yes, Misha knows the circuit very well believe me! (I think you meant to put Nurburgring, not Nuremburg)

That was a very impressive lap in a tall SUV and with three up at least. Getting around the track quick is generally about the driver, not the vehicle.

 

[CosmicBlue]

Thanks Loadmaster748, I have been able to correct my error!

 

[Tell]

I'll be getting the replacement Tavascan if I'm not dead by then .

Ateca handles well and it's nicely glued to the road on the Autobahn at 100mph plus in TDI 2.0 form. No complaints here.

 

[CosmicBlue]

I would have thought the Terramar would have been the more logical replacement? VAG haven't got a great track record in the last 3 or 4 years of getting new vehicles out for sale without significant software issues across all the brands - I'll be sitting on the fence for a bit!

 

[Tell]

Not if you don't need to replace it. It all went wrong with Vag after dieselgate. The MQB Evo platform was the problematic platform where the systems integration failed plus mib being rewritten for mib3. Mib3 wasn't so bad. Ateca just got mib3 added to it in 2020 as all Vag models. Seat / Cupra being slow compared to other Vag brands to fix the MQB Evo issues. These are the ones that effect the Leon 4 and Formentor the others just get the telematics issue which they were slow to sort out.

I normally keep my cars for 12 to 13 years. That puts the Tavascan as too soon by six years or so. I decided I'd go EV next time, skip hybrid. Reckon by 2030 they might have sorted out large Cupra EVs but always MG just down the road but look terrible. Have to see what the Chinese offering of Cupra looks like. Still seems some uncertainty in dealership as Cupra replaces Seat unless I've missed something. They think they are OK until 2030. You could see some Seat dealers finishing with Vag so your friendly Seat dealer won't to selling Cupras, will be selling something else. If you got a close Cupra dealer, the final disposition of dealerships won't be an issue. For people who change their cars every three years or so 2030 may be a long way off for them and just want some wheels in the meantime.

I'll probably end up with a refreshed Tavascan in 2030. Nice four motor model. Gives then five or so years to sort out big Vag EVs.

 

[Seastormer]

Not if you don't need to replace it. It all went wrong with Vag after dieselgate. The MQB Evo platform was the problematic platform where the systems integration failed plus mib being rewritten for mib3. Mib3 wasn't so bad. Ateca just got mib3 added to it in 2020 as all Vag models. Seat / Cupra being slow compared to other Vag brands to fix the MQB Evo issues. These are the ones that effect the Leon 4 and Formentor the others just get the telematics issue which they were slow to sort out.

I normally keep my cars for 12 to 13 years. That puts the Tavascan as too soon by six years or so. I decided I'd go EV next time, skip hybrid. Reckon by 2030 they might have sorted out large Cupra EVs but always MG just down the road but look terrible. Have to see what the Chinese offering of Cupra looks like. Still seems some uncertainty in dealership as Cupra replaces Seat unless I've missed something. They think they are OK until 2030. You could see some Seat dealers finishing with Vag so your friendly Seat dealer won't to selling Cupras, will be selling something else. If you got a close Cupra dealer, the final disposition of dealerships won't be an issue. For people who change their cars every three years or so 2030 may be a long way off for them and just want some wheels in the meantime.

I'll probably end up with a refreshed Tavascan in 2030. Nice four motor model. Gives then five or so years to sort out big Vag EVs.

I might be passed it for quick cars by then (or in a box) so my current Leon might be with me till I drop.

 

[CosmicBlue]

100% agree.

I'm a Mod here: https://www.q3ownersclub.co.uk/forums/ and when MIB3 appeared for the Q3 2022 model year (so mid 2021) tales of woe soon appeared with the virtual cockpit and dash displays just going black - nothing at all. Initially the dealers couldn't help, eventually VAG owned up but it was many months before working fixes appeared.

VAG develop software centrally for the different platforms in a company called Cariad - it was a mess, to the extent that all but one of the board were fired: May 2023- VW fire top executives at software unit Cariad

2030 is also my timeline for an EV (assuming I can live that long - 67 this year, nothing is guaranteed after all), suspect the technology and choice of available brands will have changed by then - maybe VAG won't even exist as their debt pile is greater than some countries GDP!

 

[Tell]

Then it will be MG for me... can't be having long drives to dealerships. It was the chief exec of Vag that walked the plank. Been a lot of plank walking. It was the Ethernet back bone of the MQB Evo cars and the concept of being able to do just in time updates that crumbled them, never tested. Mib3 is based on Automotive Grade Linux my 2021 post

Infotainment Semi Conductor manufacturer?

I've just been reading in Auto Zeitung that the Golf is to get a different semi conductor manufacturer for the infotainment screen when the model is facelifted. It's planned to switch from Qualcomm to Samsung. One of the reasons cited is due to the length of time it takes the system to boot up...

www.seatcupra.net

Problem with mib3 to me it's not a navigation system like mib2, pays lip service to navigation but limited destination storage, can't import POIs, radio logos blah and reboots...

Why I'm sticking. Not prepared to handle the pain.

 

[CosmicBlue]

The Samsung bit....

Going back to 2001 Audi partnered with Harman Becker Automotive to develop (I heard that 300 people worked on the project for a year) the first iterations of the MMI operating system which in itself was developed using QNX Neutrino real time OS - which if my memory serves me correctly was used in Blackberry phone handsets. Back in the day it was fairly decent by the standards back then

Harman Becker Automotive are now part of Samsung...small world isn't it??

 

[Tell]

Harman good sound system. What you don't know without further looking is whether its like Wharfdale etc branding. So the German company names bought out by the Far East. BlackBerry still own QNX unless it's changed. Hmmm Nvidia. I was asked one day why the boot screen said xxxxx on it... remembered that all Nvidia products say that name so they just carried it over to the car system. Ah... Shield. Why you see the name Shield on the mib2 standard. Nvidia Shield. Without a Google Nvidia had a hand in it. Coming back now, that's the chipset. Mib2 has a Nvidia chipset in it. I did find a comparison of that against a PC once. Qualcomm make some of it.

Why the units are so expensive low volume computer hardware.

Nb. My first navigation system was a Becker. German names sold out.

Correct

Harman Becker Automotive Systems - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

BlackBerry still owns QNX

About BlackBerry QNX

BlackBerry QNX is a trusted supplier of commercial operating systems, hypervisors, development tools, support and services, all purpose-built for the world’s most critical embedded systems. We help customers streamline their development efforts to more efficiently launch safe, secure and...

blackberry.qnx.com

So by swapping to Automotive Linux which is an open system for mib3 they were trying to reduce royalty payments to BlackBerry one can assume.

 

[CosmicBlue]

Back in about 2015 the Q3 Audi MMI 3G head units were using a pair of Nvidia Tegra processors - same as were found in the Google Nexus7 tablets at that time, a CPU and GPU on the same die, one chip was assigned to navigation stuff like 3D map modelling and the other got to handle the MMI interface and media playback (sound and video). It wouldn't be a massive leap to assume other systems in the VAG portfolio used the same architecture.

 

[Tell]

Qualcomm chipset in others you have to look out for the Q in the train name according this

https://cartechnology.co.uk/showthread.php?tid=17353&page=3

Where in the mibsolution website you can see the material filed by brand.

They might not need the same level of processing power outside of the infotainment. The nag with Mib3 was the slowness of it on swipes on the map screen. Mib4 is suppose to have faster response. We should see it this year on the Tavascan when they hit the show rooms. Then I think we can assume mib4 will be on all new models in 2025 if they keep to the mib 5 year cycle replacement into new models. They could ofcourse keep with the old spec equipment. Probably not.

 

[CosmicBlue]

Now 2 weeks into the Ateca.

Impressed with the vehicle, seems remarkably frugal with fuel so getting 30+mpg (actual) is easy, handles well and relaxing to drive on longer runs and enjoying the adaptive cruise control function - like the way it is integrated into the navigation data so is aware of roundabouts and warns in advance. It is deceptively quick without really trying.

The standard audio system is just 'OK' from a sound quality point of view, happened to get to have a play with an Ateca FR with the Beats option this week - was expecting it to be massively better and was disappointed. Will look at audio upgrade options, probably replacing the OEM speakers would be a good start - any recommendations?

Have added a USB C card reader with a short cable attached with DS tape the side of the cubby adjacent to the wireless charger so I have a local music source. In the Audi era I was able to successfully view ripped DVDs and YouTube content via SD card, the user manual for the vehicle is lacking information as to the viewable resolution of the centre display, will need that to encode the video content.