Where to get the 290 ECU file from?

[Cupra Belfast]

Hi

I was wondering if it would be possible to get hold of a copy of the 290 file for the ST and if so how would I go about loading it onto the car? Having established that the exhaust on the ST never had the middle silencer (upgrade not bypassed, simply not necessary), I'm making an educated guess that the slight sound difference must be from the ECU. I've a feeling the wider torque curve is already available, something to assist the ST, a heavier car, in matching the SC/5 door 'ring time. Having read the article in Top Gear where they took an off the shelf 280 ST round the 'ring, that still had air con (making the actual weight difference even bigger than the 45kg between off the shelf models) there's a claim made for a more progressive rear end being why the car could keep up. On it's own that doesn't seem enough, when the laws of physics still apply i.e. a 45kg+ heavier car should be slower, if delivering the same power & torque, when most of the rest of the setup is pretty much the same. I'd also possibly need an original 280ST file to reload onto the car in case something goes wrong, or instruction in how to copy it from the car.

Thanks

 

[zondaff]

I think you're mistaken, the 290 estate does feature the 2 silencer setup of the 3-5dr

On another note, the ecu file could be obtained by borrowing a 290 for the day to get their ecu log

 

[Cupra Belfast]

The 280ST and 290ST share the exact same exhaust. Schematic drawings available on another thread. Photos too. Will try to find a 290ST for the file.

 

[AndrewJB]

I'm yet to see a comparison of a 290 file with 280 file but... when I was testing a Stage1 file for REVO back in the day the comparisons of the 280 file with Golf R file... no difference.

hence why stock 280's made 300+ on Dyno's

 

[zondaff]

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=428014

I would've thought it would carry over the new system now

 

[Lentäjä]

I'm yet to see a comparison of a 290 file with 280 file but... when I was testing a Stage1 file for REVO back in the day the comparisons of the 280 file with Golf R file... no difference.

hence why stock 280's made 300+ on Dyno's

We did noticed the same thing...
Same hardware, same software on both S3 and 280 and more or less the same numbers on dyno, 280 did put down bit more torq but 1bhp less.
Neither one passed 300hp on stock though, this dyno is not known to give high numbers.

So i would say 290 does not give any more than 280.

 

[Cupra Belfast]

????

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=428014

I would've thought it would carry over the new system now

Take a look at the other threads regarding the exhaust of the ST. The 280SC & 5 door have a middle silencer, by your logic that is a three silencer system. The 280ST was released later with a new exhaust design, without the middle silencer, leaving it with the same number of silencers found in the 290SC or 5 door or ST or as you put it a two silencer system. i.e. the 280ST didn't share an exhaust design with the 280SC/5 door. It was launched with a different exhaust which hasn't been updated for the 290ST. I really don't know how to explain that any more clearly.

 

[Cupra Belfast]

dyno

I'm yet to see a comparison of a 290 file with 280 file but... when I was testing a Stage1 file for REVO back in the day the comparisons of the 280 file with Golf R file... no difference.

hence why stock 280's made 300+ on Dyno's

I've seen the link to a video with a 280 churning out 297 bhp and heard of ones nudging just over 300 bhp. I've got my 280ST booked in to have a go on a rolling road tomorrow at 1. I'm expecting around 300bhp, if not a touch more since there is no middle silencer, hence a freer flowing exhaust. There is a video of a 290 churning out 311 bhp. I've a feeling it won't quite match that, perhaps somewhere in the middle. Honestly I'm more interested to see what the torque curve looks like. If I can get hold of a 290ST I'll get it on the rolling road too, if there's an improvement in torque spread I'll be getting a copy onto my 280. The bhp figure being a couple higher would prove to be arbitrary really.

 

[Cupra Belfast]

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=428014

I would've thought it would carry over the new system now

Have a look under this thread

It will become a touch clearer.

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=428303

 

[AndrewJB]

When my car was at REVO they connected it to their hub dyno it made 307 (with VWR cup intake)

I then took my car to a local Maha Dyno, I ran it in "stock" mode with VWR cup intake and it made 305.

So 2 completely different dyno's and both made above 300.

 

[Cupra Belfast]

Those are some pretty healthy numbers! Now really excited to see the results tomorrow. P.S. How do you upload photos? It seems to want a URL when I try.

 

[Cupra Belfast]

Got my rolling road figures

When my car was at REVO they connected it to their hub dyno it made 307 (with VWR cup intake)

I then took my car to a local Maha Dyno, I ran it in "stock" mode with VWR cup intake and it made 305.

So 2 completely different dyno's and both made above 300.

Well, I'm just back in the door from Gsport Cars in Belfast that have MAHA rollers. On 97 octane (best that's available in Northern Ireland), it came back with 239.6/288.6 bhp (242.9/292.6 PS). The torque came in at 256.98/284.82 lbft (348.4/386.16 NM). I had set the car in Cupra but when I got back into it 'D' as opposed to 'S' for the gearbox had been selected, although I doubt this should really make any difference? A little bit underwhelming.

 

[Aaron87]

I wouldn't say 292bhp for a 280 is underwhelming!!

 

[Cupra Belfast]

not as bad as it seems

I wouldn't say 292bhp for a 280 is underwhelming!!

I've been looking into correction factors and it seems it may well be reading slightly low. Also 18.6 centigrade was ambient not inlet temp. It can be up to 10 deg higher so that will also deliver a slight under reading. I'd be interested to know what uplift over ambient would be expected, given how hot the engine runs, I'd guess it wouldn't be marginal.

Edit, after speaking to REVO they found the uplift after five runs between ambient and intake temperature to be +39 degrees centigrade. Factoring that back in gives:

307.1 lbft and 311.17 bhp

Pretty much what Andrew got and almost bang on what the video of a 290 on a rolling roar got.

 

[ukoldschool]

Then of course there is the possibility that all rolling roads in general over read slightly, given that they would be out of business if they told the truth. It's entirely possible that a the Leon's tested were giving the factory figure. Unless you get the engine out and put it on a flywheel dyno you are just guessing

 

[Cupra Belfast]

Quite true

Then of course there is the possibility that all rolling roads in general over read slightly, given that they would be out of business if they told the truth. It's entirely possible that a the Leon's tested were giving the factory figure. Unless you get the engine out and put it on a flywheel dyno you are just guessing

Rolling roads are the best guesstimate we have and the more accurate the correction factor, the more accurate the reading. That's the point of having an ISO standard, to take the wind out of the other correction factors which tend to scale up too much. Observing test conditions as accurately as possible would be the best way to iron out differences (unfortunately the temp uplift adds further error, a calibrated probe would be far better, but also not perfect), and yes there's a good chance that dynos over egg things a bit. I would expect that there shouldn't really be a variation of more than +/- 2.5% between different tests on the same car (when tolerances stack up), unless there is a problem with a car that is. Realistically VAG most likely design their engines to hit the 295bhp (300PS) quote (S3 & R, identical engines) at the lowest end of the range and at the high end that would lead on to 310 bhp (if going by +/- 2.5%), with an mean bhp of 302.5, so to hit 310 would be optimistic, 295 would be poor showing, somewhere 300-305 would sound more realistic.

Edit: But of course exaggerated figures are just more fun. It's basically an attempt to devise a reference point for tuning up from, as the increases will be relative to that point. If folk are hitting approximately the same numbers, the point of reference is set. In the instance of the Mk3 cupra, it's also undoing the underreporting by VAG, which is about protecting VW & Audi sales more than anything.