Power loss while Driving, Advice needed

[Ares1]

Hi there guys,

Got an issue with my mk1 cupra (180), when the engines cold, say i put it too 3rd and put my foot down from 2000 revs it pulls great and you can really feel the torque, however. When it seems the engine warms up (after 10 mins or so), I do exactly the same, bring it down to 3rd same speed and put my foot down, it revs and sounds fine however there is a noticeable difference in power, ie cannot feel the torque at all.

At first I thought it was just me haha, but a couple others have also noticed it. I thought it would be the remap, but the graph from dyno looks fine, nice gentle curve etc. Any Advice or guidance you guys can give me would be greatly appreciated! Thanks

Specs

The car was Custom mapped to 224bhp, 270lb/ft
Forge Dump valve
K&N Induction kit
Milltech Cat back exhaust
AUQ Engine v.

 

[Bigjohn84]

Theres two diffrent kinds of maps if I were you id go bk to the garage where you got it mapped and ask them to test things out. Ive read that alot of custom maps are having problems. Or ether you have a leak somewhere. Good luck finding the problem

AmD Stage 1 Map, Forge 007 DV, CDA Induction Kit, GT80 Milltek Sports Cat Back.

 

[mty12345]

Hi there guys,

Got an issue with my mk1 cupra (180), when the engines cold, say i put it too 3rd and put my foot down from 2000 revs it pulls great and you can really feel the torque, however. When it seems the engine warms up (after 10 mins or so), I do exactly the same, bring it down to 3rd same speed and put my foot down, it revs and sounds fine however there is a noticeable difference in power, ie cannot feel the torque at all.

At first I thought it was just me haha, but a couple others have also noticed it. I thought it would be the remap, but the graph from dyno looks fine, nice gentle curve etc. Any Advice or guidance you guys can give me would be greatly appreciated! Thanks

Specs

The car was Custom mapped to 224bhp, 270lb/ft
Forge Dump valve
K&N Induction kit
Milltech Cat back exhaust
AUQ Engine v.

Have you got a front mounted intercooler? If not then i could easily see the intake temps shooting sky high running that much power and torque.

 

[Ares1]

Cheers Guys, I doubt i can afford the intercooler, but if i vented the induction kit from the front grill would that help issues? would the intake temps then affect how much power is delivered?

In terms of leaks, I have not noticed anything inside or outside the car

 

[Bigjohn84]

You can never tell if you have a leak, you will ether need to get a smoke test or presure test, I keep my car in mint condition, when it went to get mapped I had a boost leak, I didn't have a clue and it was right under my nose the whole time, and the intercooler is a must, the more air you get into the engine the cooler it will get so the better it will run.

 

[Ares1]

Any recommendations for an intercooler for a average price? Ah so when you say leak, you mean to do with the turbo? Im new to turbo engines so im still learning! I will contact the mapping company, should they be able to do a smoke/pressure test? Cheers

 

[Bigjohn84]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Seat-Leon...123701?hash=item41a4f0e035:g:SIQAAOSwKtlWn8S2

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Seat-Leon...1c4c376&pid=100005&rk=2&rkt=6&sd=281940123701

Yeh boost leak mate, they can do a presure test.

 

[Ares1]

Ah much appreciated mate, does sound like the issue, ill contact the mappers and look into an inter cooler, those ebay ones look good enough to be honest, thanks

 

[Bigjohn84]

Have alook at the top of the manifold on the right hand Side, there's a pipe that runs down next to the dipstick tube, there prone to splitting, also the Y pipe on the right hand side down from the Dump Valve.

 

[Ares1]

Ah ok, I think ill just have a thorough check of the pipework tomorrow, however the turbo seems to work perfectly when the engines cold? Id assume that if there was a leak it would affect it all round?

 

[Bigjohn84]

Not to sure mate but I no when rubber gets hot it expands

 

[andycupra]

mmm you sure its not just feeling different when running on choke and then off once warmed up...?

 

[Ares1]

There is a definite powerloss once the engine warms up, ive checked many times to make sure it wasnt just a feeling , yeah that makes sense, i guess the expansion would increase the leak if it was small

So much so that you put your foot down and there is barely no torque pull at times.

 

[mty12345]

Cheers Guys, I doubt i can afford the intercooler, but if i vented the induction kit from the front grill would that help issues? would the intake temps then affect how much power is delivered?

It's not going to hurt, but i shouldn't think it would make much difference tbh. You need a proper FMIC with that much power and torque. If you have an android phone then get the torque pro app, and a ELM 327 adaptor off of ebay, then you can see what your intake temps are. You can also check for fault codes at the same time, as the lack of power you describe could just be that the car is in limp mode. The EML will only come on for emmisions related faults. If it's a overboost etc then it could be in limp mode without the EML on.

My money would be that your intake temps are probably getting so high without a FMIC that the ECU is pulling the timing back as a safety measure.

Edit: i'm not sure about the 2 intercoolers shown above, but some of the ebay jobs have turned out to offer almost no reduction in intake temps. I'd research cafefully before you commit to buying one.

 

[mty12345]

the more air you get into the engine the cooler it will get so the better it will run.

This is wrong and in fact the opposite is true, the more air you put into an engine the hotter it will run.

 

[Bigjohn84]

How do you work that out? So why the hell do we install cold air intakes?

 

[Bigjohn84]

And what I was meaning was with the intercooler you will be getting a lot more cold air flowing into the engine so it should run better, and funny that cause a car standing over night that's freezing can go straight on the rolling road and produce more power than a car that's been drivin for hours and is red hot. Meaning the cooler the engine the better the power.

 

[Ares1]

Matty, thanks I will look at those apps, the limp mode seems a plausible idea and I think it couldn't hurt to install an intercooler anyway

I guess the colder the air the denser it is therefor more efficient, and if the intercooler dosnt solve it then we may be looking at a boost leak.

Would going into limp mode show up as a fault code though?

 

[mty12345]

Matty, thanks I will look at those apps, the limp mode seems a plausible idea and I think it couldn't hurt to install an intercooler anyway

I guess the colder the air the denser it is therefor more efficient, and if the intercooler dosnt solve it then we may be looking at a boost leak.

Would going into limp mode show up as a fault code though?

Yeah the intercooler cools the air and so increases the density of the intake charge.

Obviously check for leaks and that first, but the standard intercooler on the AUQ is very small so with 270ft/lb i would have thought you definitely need a front mounted one anyway.

As for limp mode, i've had code 17705 before without the EML being on. I'm pretty sure the EML only lights up for fault codes that are related to emissions, like a misfire etc.

 

[mty12345]

How do you work that out? So why the hell do we install cold air intakes?

I didn't work it out, it's one of the fundamental rules of physics. If you compress more air into the same space, then it will be hotter.

The intake air is cooled with an intercooler to increase the density of the charge and to help prevent knock etc. It's nothing to do with cooling the engine, thats what the water and oil do.

As for cold air intakes, for the same reasons as above, the colder the charge the better.