Audi S3 GT3582R stroker Build (previously GT3071r)

[Pete225]

Thanks dude... hopefully should have some more updates soon when I get the ARBs and bushes done and get the mapping finished...



I am also waiting on one of these...

http://www.fis-control.de/index_en.html



...and looking to retro fit an RNS-E headunit



<tuffty/>

That's literally car ****! The head unit will keep with the OEM theme, good call on that!
The arbs are a great uprated feature, my friend had the bam s3 with uprated arbs and felt much more positive to drive than my standard set up.

I love some of the features on the centre cluster you can so though look amazing. How do you find all this stuff? Lol

 

[tufftybloke]

Managed to grab a ramp today so cracked on with this lot..

Started with the rear ARB so removed the back box and heatshield

Old 15mm ARB next to new 19mm ARB...

New poly bushes and painted the bush clips too...

Polished the tail pipe of course before refitting lol ;P

Then on to the front... which requires the subframe to be dropped... don't forget to do the Xenon level sensor...

...and we are done

Old 20mm ARB next to the 23mm ARB...

Gave the subframe a little clean...

Using Prawns build thread as a reference (Prawn and BigAls A3 Track Car - Post 3233)... I fitted the caster bushes...

...then fitted them to the subframe as well as the new ARB...

Next job was to swap the steering rack bush... which was an absolute ball ache to do... and not really that convinced its required but it was inexpensive and worth a punt...

One thing I had forgotten about the last time I fitted R32 ARB's to an S3 was that its next to impossible to get the rack to sit under the ARB while its in place...

So had to undo the bush clamp so the ARB could be lifted out the way...

...which made refitting the rather short bolt pretty much impossible... so fitted a longer one instead...

Time was getting on but thought I would have a look at the rear arm bushes... marked up the carriers position then unbolted it...

...needed to move the brake pipes out the way by unclipping them carefully

Looks like the OE bush is in a traditional plastic carrier but tbh it was getting a little late and this was a major pain in the ass getting this far and didn't fancy trying to get a 12 year old bush out that late in the day so put it all back together (which was just as much fun!) and put the rest of the car back together...

Finished off with a quick check of the tracking...

Discovered that the tie rod lock nuts are pretty tight but managed to get enough adjustment to get the tracking half about for now... will need to get some new locking nuts and persuade the old ones off before I go for a full alignment...

First impressions on the drive home.... car feels flatter though corners, feels very solid and tight... not really had a chance to push her but there is a noticeable improvement on feel...

I have a small issue currently with the new tyres I have fitted to the rear... I now have Hankook V12 Evo's and they seemed fine on the front but since having them on the rear too the back end seems quite loose... not grip wise as they do grip but there is a discernible lurch which is unsettling to say the least... I am not sure if it was bush related of maybe the tyres are softer walled than the FK452's I used to run...

I have upped the pressure to 35psi and things appear better but not pressed the car as yet to really see... if pressures and the rear arm bushes make no difference then they will be going...

All in all though I am well happy with the ways things are progressing... few more bits to sort out of course but a few more things off the list now

<tuffty/>

 

[tufftybloke]

So... I am walking a little funny today after buying this from TPS...

I couldn't be bothered to reclean and blast the current cam cover so bought a new one (85+vat retail!!) and will redo my current one (which is pretty clean anyway) later to sell on and get a bit back to cover this...
The casting is pretty rough so with a combo of wet and dry plus scotch bright I got rid of the worst of the roughness and prepped it for etch primer

Will finish painting that tomorrow...
Other stuff on tomorrows list are the rear arm bushes and haldex oil and filter change...

One thing I want to do when I repaint the top charge pipe is replicate the warning 'label' on the OE charge pipe...

I have considered a sticker but fairly convinced the heat will see that off... might try a little creative masking and see what stencils are available... might consider getting some laser cut maybe? could be adhesive for the sake of using as a mask I guess

<tuffty/>

 

[grahams81]

Nice work as always Tufty, did you just go for OEM R32 ARB's ? If yes what did they set you back ? If you don't mind me asking.

Cheers,

Graham.

 

[tufftybloke]

Nice work as always Tufty, did you just go for OEM R32 ARB's ? If yes what did they set you back ? If you don't mind me asking.

Cheers,

Graham.

Yeah... just std R32 bars... 23mm front, 19mm rear... can't remember the exact figure but was about £220 ish from TPS inc the dreaded and a bit of haggling

<tuffty/>

 

[tufftybloke]

Grabbed a free ramp today to get the rear arm bushes done...

Drilled the old rubber bushes to make it easier to remove...

Makeshift tool to help pull them out...

Bingo!...

Clean up the orifice...

And push in the new bushes

Alignment was not much fun... I had marked up the plate before undoing the bolts but its a tricky job getting it re-aligned...

Found it easier to fit the two forward bolts and using a handy helper and lever bars managed to get the plate to more or less line up...

All back together...

Things to note... you need to unclip the brake lines as these will be damaged as you drop the arms... I also unbolted the flexi hose bracket from the rear arm (the other end is held on a bracket welded to the pivot plate) so I could move the pivot plate up out the way to remove and refit the bushes... you also need to unclip the ABS wiring from the plastic conduit on the arms and watch out for the xenon level sensor arm as its close to being in a position to snap off if not very careful

Next job was to try and sort something out with my gearbox leak as it appears to have got worse...

...will see how that holds up... looks like I will be building the replacement gearbox over the winter...

Next job was to paint the new cam cover... etch primer...

...couple of coats of cheap ass simoniz wheel silver...

...and finally lacquer...

Next up was making my OEM looking engine bay a little more OEM looking lol... the Forge supersize DV is a bit of a giveaway in silver...

..so painted it satin black...

I think it adds to the double take effect that my engine bay has... obviously the inlet mani is a bit of a giveaway but most who have seen the engine bay are still rather surprised when I tell them the power

Will be sorting a full alignment in the next week or so and also looking at changing the tyres for something a bit grippier as she is a little lively at the moment lol

<tuffty/>

 

[tufftybloke]

Had the day off to do a few odds and sods... popped over to Bills to look at giving the cam cover another coat of lacquer and order a couple of bits from TPS so I can do the haldex oil change and replace the track rod end locking nuts... then this happened!!..

Bill worked his magic but IAT's seemed to be a little high... it was over 30 degrees in the unit and this was translating to 50+ degrees IAT over the runs... turns out my WMI wasn't working either and as the ECU will start pulling timing on approach to 40+ degrees IAT the meth needed to be working... turned out to be a sticking check valve so with that working the consistency returned and figures settled...

Was getting quite a lot of surge from 4.5k so had to feed boost in to control it... this is where it started to be obvious that std cams are not really up to the job... getting the typical torque drop off at 6000 rpm which of course was killing power... the turbo has plenty in it, I already know the engine can rev (ahem!!) and even though the turbo has a 0.63 hotside its not a massive restriction and this was backed up by EGTs post turbine hitting just over 750 degrees which is next to nothing realistically... the hotside glowed a dull red so really wasn't being taxed which left one thing... flow through the engine...

This meant that she didn't produce the 500hp I was hoping for but I know why and know how to fix it... my GT30 setup was pretty much maxed out and would consistently do around 390hp... this feels nowhere near as flat out so she has more in her...

Refitted my ECU and flashed the (current) final map in...

The scores on the doors...

Fights me all the way this one LOL...

So, next job...

LOL... well... after I have saved some money to pay for them that is lol

On the road the car is insane... second and third gear just seem relentless to the redline... the torque increase is massively noticeable... anyone considering rebuilding their 1.8 really would be foolish not to fork out the extra 500 quid for a stroker crank... its just better everywhere!

Massive thank you to Bill for taking the time to map my car today... really appreciate it dude...!

<tuffty/>

 

[tufftybloke]

Popped into Bills on the way home from work this afternoon and grabbed a couple of graphs from the dyno that I think are quite interesting..

Firstly a comparison of my old GT3071 on a 1.8 bottom end vs the GT3582 on a stroker bottom end (82mm pistons remember and not the typical 83mm that most go for)

Despite being a much larger turbo and having a larger manifold to fill there is just more of everything everywhere... was quite surprised to see this... they are both on 0.63 a/r hotsides but the GT30 was on a log manifold with a smaller internal volume and the GT30 has a much smaller turbine... merged collector and stroker ftw!!

This is of course not even finished yet... cams should hopefully allow me to use more boost between 4.5k and 6k where surge is present and lift torque... to get 500hp at my redline for example I need to be seeing just over 336ftlbs of torque at 7.8k rpm (Torque = (5252*Power)/RPM so (5252*500)/7800 = 336.7 ftlbs)... to work back power then transpose the formula as Power = (Torque*RPM)/5252

Another interesting comparison (I think) is Std K04 (unmapped) vs Hybrid K04 vs GT35

I was hoping the combo of parts I used was gong to make the car pretty drivable... when seen back to back with these other graphs I was really quite surprised how well the GT35 faired considering its classed as a huge turbo and generally considered laggy...

A K04 on a stroker is a different ball game altogether of course but in context of my build and the original spec I am really quite pleased with the outcome...

<tuffty/>

 

[grahams81]

Excellent write-up as always, the GT35 looks really responsive (like you say for its massive size)

I'm sure a nice set of cams will open the top end up nicely.

I'm not sure if you've seen but there is a lad selling a set of piper's in the classifieds, i think there brand new... can't remember.

 

[grahams81]

linky - http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=406395&highlight=piper+cams

 

[tufftybloke]

Excellent write-up as always, the GT35 looks really responsive (like you say for its massive size)

I'm sure a nice set of cams will open the top end up nicely.

I'm not sure if you've seen but there is a lad selling a set of piper's in the classifieds, i think there brand new... can't remember.

Thanks dude but I shall be going for a set of Badger5 spec cams from Cat though as I know these to work pretty damn well on the Badgerwagon so should be fine for my application...

<tuffty/>

 

[Hobbiniho]

cant wait to see it with the cams and properly tweaked , cant even begin to imagine what its like to drive with that amount of power but i bet it puts a big smile on your face

 

[tufftybloke]

cant wait to see it with the cams and properly tweaked , cant even begin to imagine what its like to drive with that amount of power but i bet it puts a big smile on your face

Second and third are over pretty quickly... will sort some videos out when I get a bit of spare time...

<tuffty/>

 

[Pimped up vario]

Excellent write up, very interesting to see the power graph comparisons. It looks like your GT35 is picking up it's heels at about the same time as the K04 and K04 hybrid setups and making more or less the same power level as the hybrid on Bill's lupo at 3500 rpm or so. It loses a bit from 3500-4500 rpm but not much then obviously more than makes up for it after that.

I shall have to refresh my memory on your engine build and see what rods your put with the stroker crank. Is it a shorter throw crank to give a shorter stroke and larger volume in the cylinder? Is the 82mm diameter piston better or did it just give you a better volumetric flow that suited your needs more? Will the cams hurt the bottom end any whilst opening up the top end?

 

[tufftybloke]

Excellent write up, very interesting to see the power graph comparisons. It looks like your GT35 is picking up it's heels at about the same time as the K04 and K04 hybrid setups and making more or less the same power level as the hybrid on Bill's lupo at 3500 rpm or so. It loses a bit from 3500-4500 rpm but not much then obviously more than makes up for it after that.

I shall have to refresh my memory on your engine build and see what rods your put with the stroker crank. Is it a shorter throw crank to give a shorter stroke and larger volume in the cylinder? Is the 82mm diameter piston better or did it just give you a better volumetric flow that suited your needs more? Will the cams hurt the bottom end any whilst opening up the top end?

Longer throw on stroker crank... 92.8mm vs 86.4mm... 82mm piston is just a size I chose so I wouldn't have to use the thinner ALT head gasket and mess up my comp ratio

Cams might upset the bottom end a little but in the grand scheme of things the effect will be negliable

Here is a picture lovingly robbed from Integrated Engineering's website that gives an idea of the effect of cams...

<tuffty/>

 

[Pimped up vario]

Yes, sorry for the silly question. It was after my bedtime and the old grey cells weren't on full chat. That makes more sense with longer throw creating more volume, then thicker gasket to set the compression ratio.

I seen that graph when I was trying to see what a 500 bhp 1.8t engines power delivery would be like. I have a 01 Audi a6 so have a bit more space in the engine bay to work with turbo setup, twin turbo maybe? But that as you say it is virtually negligible in the lower end of the power delivery.

 

[tufftybloke]

Twin turbo would be a challenge... stroker FTW...

Stroker and GTX2867r on a tubular manifold and external wastegate would be a nice setup I reckon

<tuffty/>

 

[Pimped up vario]

Does FTW mean "for the win"? The larger volume motor does sound like a winner causing the turbos to spool up slightly earlier. Thanks for the heads up on that turbo combination, it spools as early as the gt28rs and can flow enough air to support 400-430 bhp on a 1.8t so maybe a bit more on a stroker engine.

I wouldn't mind being able to figure out how to design a small turbo to boost well from 1500 rpm to 4000 rpm making 165-200 bhp @ 3500-4000 rpm and then copying the sequential twin turbo setup of the Toyota Supra. The family keep me well busy but I'll not give up easily. Thanks again.

 

[tufftybloke]

Would you actual fecking believe it!!!... was at our local Sainsbury Friday on my way to Bill's in the S3... and some a**hole reversed into the bumper!!! FFS!!!

...and the worst bit...

I didn't see it happen but luckily there was a witness who had taken all the details down and waited for me to return... actually reinstated my faith in people... apart from the a**hole who drove into the car of course.. apparently is was a scruffy piece of cr*p Astra that looks like crashing into other cars is a hobby!!... w*nker!!!

I called the police and gave the details and the insurance company know too...

I am massively annoyed that people think this ok to do and tbh I am glad that it was only the bumper and hoping that they can do a smart repair on it rather than take the car to a body shop... if that happens then I am not sure I will pursue it as I really don't want to leave my car with anyone I don't know...

The scuff should mostly polish out but the cracking from the deformation will mean it needs paint..

What is it with people!!!??!!

(rant over).... (ish...)


Had a call from the local Police today... they have spoken to the owner of the car that hit mine and turns out he is quite old... he apparently wants to settle outside of insurance which is fine be me so going to get some quotes for a smart repair...

In other news.... I fitted the freshly painted cam cover...

Sanded down the charge pipe...

Primed it....

Painted it silver...

...and lacquered it

...and the clamps of course...

However in my haste there are a couple of runs so decided to leave it all over night to harden more then will attack it with some 2000 grit wet n dry and give it a go over with the DA...

This of course left me with a bit of a problem... so applied a temporary fix

Not very OE I know but I want to make sure the charge pipe is right before I fit it...

Just the inlet to do

<tuffty/>

 

[Pimped up vario]

Nightmare. Make sure they check the fixtures at the wing that they're not cracked and for paint damage were the bumper meets the metal. It wouldn't matter where you park too, they still end up either beside you and bump their door off yours or knock yours as in your case. I'd try and park in a place that's empty or far away from everyone and come out of the shop again to find someone parked beside you and think how come. They're like a fly to crap. And I only drive an old cordoba, she needs all the help she can get though . Hope you get sorted without too much bother.