PhilW's Mk3 Ibiza Project Thread - 3071 - Now Breaking!

[ibizacupra]

I was of the understanding that the long term/multiplicative fuel trim (18.8%) was a result of under load/boost?

on a wideband ecu your right.. I am not so sure though how it can be the same on narrowband, which switches off its lambda control under loads though.. block 001 will drop to zero under loads where it ignores lambda for correction. thereafter its relying on map itself and airflow, and loads to determin fueling.

the learned value on cruise is being applied across the board tho, which is resulting in over rich under boost..

when I see this during mapping, the fuel table and injector size has to be adjusted so cruise throttle is close and 001 is not trying to adjust to correct, then the underload fueling can be addressed and mapped to suit.

your ecu and map seems to have opposite ends, running lean on cruise (too large a maf if >80mm OD?) and its fuel trim is cocking up the underload fueling as a consequence.

I think craigs onto something by questioning going to smaller MAF.. (I dont remember what size you run now)

 

[PhilW]

Afr doesn't adjust out what you've put in via lemmiwinks, just seems to make the trim figure different.

Ibiza element in a S4/73mm ID MAF. Everything is how Alex run this ecu now.

Do I just get the AFR correct and just ignore the trims? Which I can do.

 

[GotBoost]

If you run a smaller maf housing and your trims drop to +-5%, the main fuel map and the calculated Air Flow are close. Do this first then report back, if trims are close then report back WOT AFRs.

This is a backwards working, as we are trying to adjust a combination of Maf / housing / fuel pressure etc, instead of remapping the ECU. If the trims are close, then the Air flow is proportional to the fuel flow.

 

[GotBoost]

Afr doesn't adjust out what you've put in via lemmiwinks, just seems to make the trim figure different.

Ibiza element in a S4/73mm ID MAF. Everything is how Alex run this ecu now.

Do I just get the AFR correct and just ignore the trims? Which I can do.

What are your trims after you alter the Primary Fueling?

 

[ibizacupra]

Afr doesn't adjust out what you've put in via lemmiwinks, just seems to make the trim figure different.

Ibiza element in a S4/73mm ID MAF. Everything is how Alex run this ecu now.

Do I just get the AFR correct and just ignore the trims? Which I can do.

because your lemmiwinks adjustments are across the board, including the regions the narrowband controls at.. and it will dial out what you've dialed in, whilst its that far wrong.

 

[PhilW]

What are your trims after you alter the Primary Fueling?

They go the wrong way.

For example. Start trim was -18% and was seeing mid 10's @ WOT.

I take out 10% on the primary to get my AFR back to where i want it. Runs great.

Trims are now -25.4% which is the max adjustment then it throws a lean code.

Craig, i think we need some proper time on the dyno. lol.


I will try the 70mm S3 MAF but i fear whilst the trims will be close to reqired spec the AFR will still be rich.

because your lemmiwinks adjustments are across the board, including the regions the narrowband controls at.. and it will dial out what you've dialed in, whilst its that far wrong.

Yeah thats whats happening.


What about using the SEL Scaling to adjust it, channel 12? Scales specified load. Ive heard of using this to pull in the AFR. Any thoughts?


Thanks for the help tho guys, really appreciate it. Might be worth seeing if Kev @ Revo could weigh in on this as well.

 

[IbizaAlex]

The only thing thats still different is the injectors?

 

[PhilW]

The only thing thats still different is the injectors?

I'll eventually change them to 630's to drop the duty on the 550's.


Small update, but a good one. Dropped the SEL Scaing, channel 12 by 10% this morning and reset my trims, drove 30miles in about 1 hour with some WOT sections.

Trims were 0.4% and 9.4% and AFR was much better. Car felt just as good.

Any thoughts?

 

[ibizacupra]

thats good progress. I cant say i have ever played with ch 12
good info

 

[PhilW]

thats good progress. I cant say i have ever played with ch 12
good info

Thanks Bill, gonna drop another 5% and see how it looks for the drive home.

New coolant pipe is being sorted currently and i'll probably get it on the dyno again on sunday.

 

[MarkWales]

will come see this on the dyno

 

[PhilW]

Mid 11's @ WOT and 5.5% fuel trims now. Happy days.

I could keep going but ill play safe with the fuelling.

Running 1.8 bar now on all these tests i should add, dear lord its scary. lol.

 

[Damoegan]

Glad your getting near to what you want, Phil

 

[joehirth]

Mid 11's @ WOT and 5.5% fuel trims now. Happy days.

I could keep going but ill play safe with the fuelling.

Running 1.8 bar now on all these tests i should add, dear lord its scary. lol.

Now that sounds more like it woop

 

[PhilW]

Did end up going back on the dyno today.

Ran 25psi. No timing added. I mean Revo timing set to 0.

310whp and 302.9 derived ft/lbs of torque.

Graph to follow. Not as high as I was hoping but there's still a lot to come with timing and maybe more boost. So far so good anyway.

 

[PhilW]

Graph.

 

[wild willy]

Nice graph Phil, can't wait to pay Craig a visit myself, maybe over christmas.
I've used channel 12 for a few years now and with oversized maff tubes with my APR software.
When ever load (sel scaling) is increased i found fueling within the program increased Automatically but linearly.
If you use an oversized maff you need to increase fueling proportionally by the increase in maff csa. Similarly if you use an undersized maff the fueling is reduced by the reduction in maff csa using primary fuel scale.

 

[Scott-o]

Been watching this and glad to see your getting there now! Graph looks a goodun too!

 

[GotBoost]

Be interesting to see what this would make on Bills dyno Phil ( my old Dastek ).

Im having to battle a few peoples opinions that my new Mainline dyno reads too low compared to the Dastek. I dont think Bills under any threat of his dyno becoming the 'HeartBreaker' with mine here LOL

 

[MarkWales]

tell me about it craig down over 10hp at wheels since having it decatted

good run today and sounded healthy from where I was Phil