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0-60 confusing
- Thread starter Martin_DSG
- Start date
i would have thought you could nudge 60 in 2nd in the petrol fr or cupra, but first and second gear are definitely very short in the diesel car.
Maybe on the speedo but I doubt it for a real figure. Most places do 0-62 anyway. The gears are a lot shorter in the cupra than they were in my old rx8.
If only they made a rear drive leon
or even better, put the Haldex/Quattro/4 Motion system into the Leon and add a bit more power to make up for the added weight!
That would be good.. Shame that the VAG group will probably never let it happen as it will impose too much on the supposed premium brands!
you would have more fun with pure rear wheel drive than with a haldex 4wd set-up (powerslides). although the 4wd set-up will give you huge tuning potential with putting big bhp on the road. i think there are some counties that sell 4wd leons.
Diesel engines never have a great 0-60 (or 62), with a like for like car the engine is heavier and also takes a moment for the Turbo to kick in.
On my TT TDi there is definitely a light lag before the Turbo comes in.
Gearing also makes a big difference on a 5 speed car you may be able to hit 60 in second, a 6 speed car may need an extra change.
Also remember the Saxo VTR was always sold as a warm hatch, the DSG Leon TDi isn't really sold as a performance car, whereas the FR is, so it may be geared more for economy than performance.
As said where a diesel does come into its own is overtaking acceleration.
On my TT TDi there is definitely a light lag before the Turbo comes in.
Gearing also makes a big difference on a 5 speed car you may be able to hit 60 in second, a 6 speed car may need an extra change.
Also remember the Saxo VTR was always sold as a warm hatch, the DSG Leon TDi isn't really sold as a performance car, whereas the FR is, so it may be geared more for economy than performance.
As said where a diesel does come into its own is overtaking acceleration.
elliottjackson
Guest
2nd gear in a petrol FR lets you hit 60-65, depending whether you hit the redline or not. That's going by the speedo which is always a few percent off though.
I'll prob be flamed to death for saying this but I'm not convinced that diesels really have to be slower 0-60, its just that they're generally heavier, less powerful and often don't have suitable gear ratios, kind of like people have said above. If you evened out those things I think they'd be equivalent, I'm not convinced that high torque really creates problems getting power down. My thoughts are:
Torque is "turning force" of the engine, in other words the amount of power per rev. So something that produced half the torque would nonetheless produce as much force if it were revving twice as high.
The limitation with acceleration "off the line" in our front wheel drive cars is the grip from the tyres. They can only grip enough to transfer a certain amount of power. If we theoretically say this is 100 BHP for argument's sake, it makes no difference whether its from a more torquey diesel engine revving slightly lower, or a less torquey petrol engine revving a bit higher.
I'll prob be flamed to death for saying this
but I'm not convinced that diesels really have to be slower 0-60, its just that they're generally heavier, less powerful and often don't have suitable gear ratios, kind of like people have said above. If you evened out those things I think they'd be equivalent, I'm not convinced that high torque really creates problems getting power down. My thoughts are:Torque is "turning force" of the engine, in other words the amount of power per rev. So something that produced half the torque would nonetheless produce as much force if it were revving twice as high.
The limitation with acceleration "off the line" in our front wheel drive cars is the grip from the tyres. They can only grip enough to transfer a certain amount of power. If we theoretically say this is 100 BHP for argument's sake, it makes no difference whether its from a more torquey diesel engine revving slightly lower, or a less torquey petrol engine revving a bit higher.
But an engine/transmission which immediately puts down the power at less revs will be more likely to spin the wheels than one which gradually puts down the same power by revving higher before peak output, I reckon...
Hi Gainful,
I agree if the power got put down at lower speeds then you'd get more wheelspin. I don't think that's really petrol vs diesel though, just more power vs less power, whether from petrol or diesel or gear ratios.
You can do about 30 in 1st in the petrol Fr and I think someone said it was about the same in the diesel, so the different revs and torque should "cancel out".
for example, at 10 mph they'd both be producing 1/3 of their total power, at 30 mph 100% of their power, so the difference in acceleration is just that the petrol is a bit more powerful at each speed in 1st gear, so if there is sufficient grip to put the power down it can accelerate the car faster.
Just a thought anyway
I agree if the power got put down at lower speeds then you'd get more wheelspin. I don't think that's really petrol vs diesel though, just more power vs less power, whether from petrol or diesel or gear ratios.
You can do about 30 in 1st in the petrol Fr and I think someone said it was about the same in the diesel, so the different revs and torque should "cancel out".
for example, at 10 mph they'd both be producing 1/3 of their total power, at 30 mph 100% of their power, so the difference in acceleration is just that the petrol is a bit more powerful at each speed in 1st gear, so if there is sufficient grip to put the power down it can accelerate the car faster.
Just a thought anyway
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