Broken Turbo, what options? (~£2000)

[james333]

Hello, and welcome to another of James' "My S3 is broken" threads

My turbo has started to make a very faint/subtle ticking noise so im not expecting it to last that long.

What are my options? A replacement K04 isnt one!

I would love to go BT but im affraid its jusnt not possible at the moment, even though I would fit it all myself, its just too much £. I am however being forced to spend some money on a turbo it seems so.......

JBS hybrid? Looks tempting, and I would also get A JBS high flowing exhaust manifold too. These are quite expensive but for £2000 I should get in the region of 320bhp.

Backdraft hybrid? This is quite a lot less than the JBS one but JBS claim 300bhp with the turbo and a re map, where BD say it thiers will only achive 300bhp with a free flowing DP and a different cat which is bumping the price up! The JBS manifold is still an option with this turbo though.

And finally........

GT2871r Eliminator kit, I accept this is not in any way a viable otion if I was considering BT, BUT........ If I dont want more than say 330bhp, can this be mapped to suit, I know it is no GT2871r because the exhaust housing is restrictive but again, im thinking JBS manifold to help with lag and flow? (If they actually get it manufactured and on the shelf, its taking ages!)

Basically, if I have to spend a good few £100 on a turbo, I dont mind spending that little bit more on a better turbo, manifold, injectors and map, probably a fuel pump and FPR if I need them? What would the differences in characteristics be?

Any input would be great but please dont suggest saving a bit more for BT as I really dont want spending to get out of hand and rods etc will be too much at the moment. I know a lot of people dont like the eliminators but is that because they say that they are 400bhp turbos but really arent?

One other thought now though, if I were to get the eliminator, could I make it into a true 2871r by getting the exhaust housing? This may be a stepping stone to BT if I get to a point where I can fit rods etc.

Thanks, James

 

[james333]

Ooops, sorry for the long post!

 

[ibizacupra]

JBS K04 mani is'nt available tho..... is it?

 

[pj1985]

Wouldnt do the eliminator kit. Everyone moans about them. Seem more hassle than their worth. Dont think you'll get the jbs figures for their k04 hybrid unless you have an uprated downpipe either imo so Backdraft set up it is if you can get an uprated exhaust mani. Bill might have other ideas in budget or for a mani.

 

[james333]

JBS K04 mani is'nt available tho..... is it?

Dont think it is yet, it seems to be "in the next few months" all the time, really looking forward to seeing figures, would the BD kit be that different to the JBS as £200 saved would pay partly for the DP.

Wouldnt do the eliminator kit. Everyone moans about them. Seem more hassle than their worth. Dont think you'll get the jbs figures for their k04 hybrid unless you have an uprated downpipe either imo so Backdraft set up it is if you can get an uprated exhaust mani. Bill might have other ideas in budget or for a mani.

Arent JBS rollers quite accurate though? they claim a standard car gets standard figures?
Initially they said 340bhp is possible with the turbo but I wouldnt expect that much.

What happened to the JBS tubular manifold? Is that worth getting? I think it was £200 more though. They need to get the site up and running!!!!

Thanks

 

[pj1985]

I think the JBS tubular mani was discontinued for the cast ones like the k03 tubular manis were. I dont think there will be much in it between the JBS and Backdraft one tbh. Alot will be in how the turbo is hybrid and the mapping. Without a downpipe I do not think you will get 320bhp with the JBS hybrid k04. The downpipe is something you change for a stage 2 map on a standard k04 so I cannot see how you would not need it to get the 320bhp with their hybrid. It would be pointless not having it, more free flowing is better.

Not saying JBS do but you can make rollers read whatever you want. I only really take notice of figures from rollers that are known to be quite accurate and when the tuning has not been carried out by the company running the dyno.

 

[ibizacupra]

i have'nt seen a hybrid k04 make 320bhp type figures yet.
anyone got a dyno of one with specs of what other parts were on a hybrid and what it got?

 

[DaNnY_LaD]

i have'nt seen a hybrid k04 make 320bhp type figures yet.
anyone got a dyno of one with specs of what other parts were on a hybrid and what it got?

Is it because of the K0/x type fitment flange being too Narrow/restrictive?

 

[james333]

http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m136/JBS_Auto_Designs/JBS05STDMANISTG1-1.jpg

Is this any good or do you mean a dyno readout from a different companies RR?

The peak torue looks really good, I have emailed turbo technics and owens for prices and details of what they can do, hopefully hear back tomorrow. hat are my options for manifold and DP if jbs dont get thiers done soon? Thanks

 

[james333]

oops, duplicate post...

 

[james333]

Hmmm, seems im in trouble for posting a link to the rolling road graph, anyone know why this is?
I made a few posts to get my post count up so I could post the graph as an image, hope it didnt piss anyone off. sorry

 

[ibizacupra]

Is it because of the K0/x type fitment flange being too Narrow/restrictive?

have you seen the runners on a k04 manifold. barely get a finger up them... and they will support 300+bhp?
75mm downpipes and exhaust manifold runners which are barely index finger wide is like blowing thru a straw into a drainpipe... where do you think the restriction would be to flow (power)

 

[wild willy]

have you seen the runners on a k04 manifold. barely get a finger up them... and they will support 300+bhp?
75mm downpipes and exhaust manifold runners which are barely index finger wide is like blowing thru a straw into a drainpipe... where do you think the restriction would be to flow (power)

After seeing the k04 mani Bill, do you feel reasonable gains can be had from a quality after market one.

 

[pj1985]

i have'nt seen a hybrid k04 make 320bhp type figures yet.
anyone got a dyno of one with specs of what other parts were on a hybrid and what it got?

With a standard k04 downpipe I dont think it could so I dont see why/how JBS have told him that to get 320bhp their hybrid doesnt need one. One of the first things to change to make more flow surely! I have seen it mentioned that the standard k04 mani is worse than a k03 but not sure if this is true or just talk.

For a mani other than JBS I dont know, Backdraft might do one or be able to help. Bill also. For a downpipe if you are running a standard k04 now then any uprated k04 dp for your car will fit the hybrid fine. Blueflame would be somewhere to start looking.

 

[jonathanp]

I have a JBS05 on mine but I couldn't tell you what its running (but I doubt its much over 300bhp if even that high) and also bear in mind you need to upgrade your engine internals if you're going to go this route (well jbs route anyway)

P.S. Cars running quite nicely now bill I'll try and send you the logs later today

 

[ibizacupra]

I have a JBS05 on mine but I couldn't tell you what its running (but I doubt its much over 300bhp if even that high) and also bear in mind you need to upgrade your engine internals if you're going to go this route (well jbs route anyway)

P.S. Cars running quite nicely now bill I'll try and send you the logs later today

good good.

I am sure there would be flow increases from a better flowing manifold over OE cast one. It is pretty poor.

When you change these things you move around the choke point, so once manifold is allowed to flow well, the next restriction to flow will likely be the turbo's spec itrself - albeit with x more bhp now before it reaches the limit of flow ability of the unit at all

 

[Ianb]

What a puzzle for you James.

The upshot is that what ever way you look at it spending well over 2k is the only way to make the most of a better flowing turbo.

The B/T kits are pretty expensive and on a £2k budget you're very very limited. I've yet to hear good reports on the Eliminators. The manifold is key as Bill as pointed out. I spent a shed load on mine and have decided to keep it as it's too good to give it away. I'd stick with an OE replacement or go the whole hog and spend a shed load....there's so much choice then.....unless Bill has some budget ideas for 2k?

Ian

 

[wild willy]

James send your current tubby away to be overhauled and given the hybrid treatment for less than £500.
With a correctly sprung actuator you will see 300 bhp ish. combined with an aftermarket mani (which don't exist at present) and an intake manifold (Sem) and other stage 2 mods, lower end big turbo power gains can be reached. (320bhp)

 

[james333]

I have sent an email to a few people, the only ones to get back so far are owens, where can I get it done for £500?
What are stage 2 mods? downpipe and de cat?

I know it would be worth doing it once and doing it right (ie big turbo) but I really cant afford to spend much more on a car, the extra £2-3k just isnt possible, I know I will always want more but I have accepted that I ned to make something of myself before I can splash out on really fast cars.

I think it wil have to be hybrid. As my turbo isnt in the best shape now, spending a few £100 extra isnt as extreme as a conversion, maybe enough poke to beat my mates corrado in a straight line

Will need to find a good turbo company, is there any others appart from owens and turbo technics?
Thanks for the input everyone

 

[james333]

with custom code, would I need to have it re mapped straight away or would it run fine but with more power on the generic map? I mean, does it calculate things from available air or just requested boost meaning 0% change until its mapped for the new characteristics?