Revo performance figures

[Number86]

Hi chaps. DON'T FLAME ME STRAIGHT AWAY

I've done the reading up on here regarding the Revo map (stage 1) for the LCR. People stating you'll get circa 265 BHP. That's great!

My question is, I've seen it mentioned a few times, and on peoples sigs that they're running a revo map and quoting their BHP as circa 240. Am I missing something somewhere, or can the achievable figures vary so much!?

Thanks for the info.

 

[RobM]

There are a few factors here...

Firstly, every car is different so figures vary. Some respond well to tuning, others don't.
Secondly, marketing has a lot to answer for. There has been a lot of 'debate', shall we say, over the figures that Revo claim and what's actually achievable. I was pointed towards a long discussion on Briskoda on this subject that made very interesting reading.
Also, dyno lottery plays a big part here. There are so many variable factors in operating a dyno that the results are rarely consistent and true. Some give higher readings than they should, others lower, it really is a lottery!

Realistically you can expect 250-260bhp from a simple Stage 1 remap. Once you start adding extra mods, this may rise a little. But on a standard car or a car with minor bolt on mods, in the real world, expect that sort of power.

Of course, if you don't like that, you can keep going from dyno to dyno until one gives you the result you want. As somebody (apologies, I forget who) on this forum had in their signature... it's only a Dyno Lottery if you don't get the figure you want!

 

[Cowie]

Also could the 240 Bhp quoted be from a mapped 210LCR whereas 250-265 is from a 225LCR

 

[nick-barnes07]

i got a cupra r , re map, dunno who but it boosts really well , forge fmic , forge hoses , blueflame exhaust from the turbo back 3" , k&n induction , and a couple more mods and it only got 259bhp on the rollers

 

[RobM]

Also could the 240 Bhp quoted be from a mapped 210LCR whereas 250-265 is from a 225LCR

No, because the 210 and 225 engines are 99.9% the same and when remapped, they make the same sort of figures. There is very little difference between them even when standard.

i got a cupra r , re map, dunno who but it boosts really well , forge fmic , forge hoses , blueflame exhaust from the turbo back 3" , k&n induction , and a couple more mods and it only got 259bhp on the rollers

That sounds about right to me, you should be pleased

 

[RikH]

you've got to remember what car it is as well
i know Pabs' LC is around 240 as well

 

[Number86]

High 50's is great. 5BHP is neither here nor there really. But low 40's when I was expecting (hoping) for 260ish is a little dissapointing.

 

[RobM]

Also, just remember that peak power figures only tell half the story. They are great for bragging rights down the pub, but that's about it.

If a remap gave you 20bhp consistently over the entire rev range you would notice it a lot more than 20bhp at the peak of it's power curve.

Plus the torque increase might be more substantial than the power increase, and it's torque that moves the car at the end of the day, so that's more important to bear in mind.

Then you have the power and torque curve itself. If the power is nice and progressive and builds strongly and evenly throughout the rev range, you'll be able to use the power a lot easier than a car that produces it's power in a big burst, or a car that needs to be revved to within an inch of it's life. Same with torque... a nice, flat torque spread over the entire rev range would be ideal, so at any point you know you have torque on tap.

What I'm getting at, is don't get too caught up on headline power figures. There is much more to it than just that!

 

[andyj]

when pete had his (now mine) 210 LCR R&R'd with just Revo, it came out at 265Bhp @ the fly.

Don't forget that you can quote Bhp twice.... @ the fly, and @ the wheel.... difference being the power loss through the transmission system.

 

[HarveyGTI]

the key thing you are forgetting here is the RR dyno lottery, it can differ so so much from tuner to tuner, and if the place you have got it RR'd at does not really know their stuff about the VAG cars, then it will most likely be putting out less then what it should be, due to an incorrect RR setup

 

[RobM]

As I said above though, it's only a lottery if the figure produced is too low.

If you get a nice high figure, it must be accurate and from then on, that's what power your car produces.

If you get a low figure, it must be because of the dyno lottery and the way the dyno is operated, my car must make more power than that....

 

[Feel]

Also could the 240 Bhp quoted be from a mapped 210LCR whereas 250-265 is from a 225LCR

I think the above is the answer - are you sure that when you're looking at figures of 240bhp, they're figures for LCRs and not figures for Leon Cupra's??

 

[Number86]

I'm not sure

I hope that's the case anyway.

Revo don't RR your car though do they? So I guess I'll never actually know what sort of improvement I get (figure wise), if I go down the remap route...

 

[warren_cox]

If you get it mapped somewhere where there is a RR facility they may roller it for a few extra quid.

TBH, once you get over the 250bhp mark in a FWD car, its as much the ability of the cars chassis / set up, and the drivers outright ability to drive that will make for a fast car.

I was on a a track day at Prodrive where a set of identical Leons were being driven by about 8 people, and one guy was significantly quicker than the rest of us just down to his ability to late brake and carry speed through corners. It was quite an eye opener to see how much difference a driver can brake. You could have given him 20bhp less than the rest of us and he'd probably still beaten us all.

Sometimes its too easy to focus on bhp, when we could potentially all benefit from some driver training too (and a few choice suspension mods).

 

[HarveyGTI]

As I said above though, it's only a lottery if the figure produced is too low.

If you get a nice high figure, it must be accurate and from then on, that's what power your car produces.

If you get a low figure, it must be because of the dyno lottery and the way the dyno is operated, my car must make more power than that....

not true necessarily

of course if the figure is higher, then you tend not to think its a lottery, as the car has exceeded your expectations so you are then in your mind quite pleased with the result...unless of course your car is producing an extra 20+bhp over what the map should be producing.....then you would start to question it... is it still accurate?

Whats not to say the next RR is actually giving you a more accurate reading but because it is less, you then think well is their an issue with the map, issue with the car etc

I think RR figures sometimes have to be taken with a pinch of salt....

 

[Number86]

coxw. If getting a map, I was never intending it to increase launch times or track performance (I never intend on taking a car I'v paid for onto a track ) just to get the most bang for my buck to improve overtaking and motorway driving!

But I understand what you're saying.
You should read the RX8 forum. It's the polar opposite of this one.
"You've never going to win a drag race you bought the wrong car, wait until we get to the twisties then we'll have em."

RX8 is a lovely car though.

 

[cordobabrendy]

im not sure if its been mentioned before, but when you get the car revo'd it could be set to a lower boost setting than some of the fellas running 260bhp.

 

[RobM]

not true necessarily

of course if the figure is higher, then you tend not to think its a lottery, as the car has exceeded your expectations so you are then in your mind quite pleased with the result...unless of course your car is producing an extra 20+bhp over what the map should be producing.....then you would start to question it... is it still accurate?

Whats not to say the next RR is actually giving you a more accurate reading but because it is less, you then think well is their an issue with the map, issue with the car etc

I think RR figures sometimes have to be taken with a pinch of salt....

Then you have just proven that what I've said is true... despite opening that comment with 'not true'.

You have just said yourself that dyno figures vary, which is the point I was making. But I was also making the point that people tend not to argue with semi-realistic figures that come out higher than expected, they only argue with figures that come out lower.

 

[HarveyGTI]

Then you have just proven that what I've said is true... despite opening that comment with 'not true'.

You have just said yourself that dyno figures vary, which is the point I was making. But I was also making the point that people tend not to argue with semi-realistic figures that come out higher than expected, they only argue with figures that come out lower.

i used the get out clause and threw in the word "necessarily"

 

[CRAIGLCR]

i paid £30 for a power run on a RR this was when the car was standard!! producing a healthy 214BHP and 200ftlb torque!! it will be interesting to see the new figures once i get revo'd!! i will post the results, but you will have to hold out for a short while as funds are low n the bl**dy waterpumps just gone!!!!