oil light flickering and engine jumpy on new car!! please help!!

[shaneseat]

on 1.9tdi, 2002, 110

any ideas??

 

[james walker]

what does engine hunting mean mate please?

 

[LEE69]

Check the oil and pressure.

 

[Cupra Ross]

on 1.9tdi, 2002, 110

any ideas??

Thats a very vague description mate. Do you mean that the car is struggling to maintain its idle speed? If its dropping under about 700rpm, the oil light will illuminate to show low oil pressure.

Could be a few things, blocked EGR, faulty injector, cracked injector return hoses, faulty MAF, jammed anti shudder valve, vacuum leak. VAG-COM would be my first port of call.

 

[shaneseat]

sorry guys, yeah it starts on button, i went with intention of buying, test drove it yesterday seems a bit down on power compared to my own, mines a 90hp 1.9tdi with 125k and this one has 85k, confirmed by service his and mots.

it starts perfect, if a bit loud and rattly for a second, then just while driving noticed the oil light flickering a couple of times just milliseconds, then going downhill slowly coming up to a juction slowing gently with the gear i could feel it upping/downing revs very quickly on its own.

any ideas??

 

[shaneseat]

anyone any ideas??

 

[Andrewcupra TDI]

walk away then i would if its not right

 

[Slimy]

walk away then i would if its not right

+1, if it ain't yours then the only thing you need to worry about is knowing which direction to walk to get as far away as possible!

 

[Cupra Ross]

Sounds like the chain on the oil pump is slipping. Walk away and find another. There are plenty of good ones around.

 

[Muttley]

Chain drives Do Not Slip. They can fail, if one part seizes and the teeth get stripped off the cogwheels, but that isn't slip. Even less likely, the tensioner could have failed allowing the chain to disengage from the sprockets, but again that isn't slip in the loss-of-friction sense. Chain drives don't rely on friction, but on mechanical engagement of the chain roller with the sprocket teeth. Very efficient too.

Low oil pressure is not a good sign, and would have me walking away too. Rattle on startup is another sign of poor oil circulation. It may be as simple as a blocked oil filter, but if it hasn't been spotted and corrrected already, I'd worry about what else might have been left undone on the car.

 

[Cupra Ross]

Chain drives Do Not Slip. They can fail, if one part seizes and the teeth get stripped off the cogwheels, but that isn't slip. Even less likely, the tensioner could have failed allowing the chain to disengage from the sprockets, but again that isn't slip in the loss-of-friction sense. Chain drives don't rely on friction, but on mechanical engagement of the chain roller with the sprocket teeth. Very efficient too.

Low oil pressure is not a good sign, and would have me walking away too. Rattle on startup is another sign of poor oil circulation. It may be as simple as a blocked oil filter, but if it hasn't been spotted and corrrected already, I'd worry about what else might have been left undone on the car.

Chain tensioners in Saab and Nissan engines fail regularly, they are 2 examples from personal experience which can allow the chain to slip over the teeth or in the worst case, to jump the sprockets altogether.

I haven't heard of this problem on a VAG engine but its not outwith the realms of possibility. Such an occurence would be consistent with the symptoms the OP reported, although many other things could also be at fault. IMO a blocked oil filter is very unlikely as it would cause failure of the oil pump seals and the demise of the engine in very quick time. The top end would also be extremely noisy and that noise would not subside as quickly as the OP says it does.

I think the consensus here is to walk away. We could spend all year debating the root cause of the problem but its an exercise in futility at the end of the day. Its not a vehicle I'd be interested in looking into further after the test drive.

 

[shaneseat]

im a silly bollocks.........what have i done........

i went and test drove the car again, and it seemed all bloody ok!! none of the above problems again, so i believed the sellers story that it had been sitting for a while and just needed 'blew out'

so to cut a long story short, i thought the car has reeeealy low miles and good history, it couldnt possibly be a whole lot wrong with it and did the deal........

so driving home was ok for a while then i noticed the bloody thing happening again...... it was a private sale and the guy was a ****, as in when i pointed out a couple of wee things was persisten in sayin thats wee stuff son, that cars a great goin wee motor!! etc etc but ive been looking for a nice clean low milage one for months and this was the only one that fitted the bill.......

i know its easy to say should have just walked away...... but instead of rubbing salt in the wounds, which im not saying anyone here would...... please help me with some ideas to remedy... .. im gonna try to get vagcom onto it and see what it throws up.

please keep fingers crossed lads, i think everyones been here, bought a motor, your gut just wasnt sure about...... and then held breath for a few weeks to see if all went ok....

thanks for the replies guys, and as i say any help would be greatly appreciated

 

[shaneseat]

to add to the whole scenario, went out this morning to start it, and it blew out a lot of white smoke and was very lumpy on idle, no oil light, but very jumpy, and on the first turn of the key couple of big jerks

is this by any chance a faulty maf or something?

 

[shaneseat]

and yeah guys sorry, bought the car before the replies went up, thought it might have been a cheap fix but getting worried so any help would be great!!

 

[shaneseat]

put vag com onto it, heres what came up...........would these have anything to do with above symptoms?

VCDS Version: Release 908.2
Data version: 20100326

Wednesday,14,April,2010,19:42:02:37530

Chassis Type: 1M - Seat Leon/Toledo
Scan: 01 02 03 08 15 17 19 22 35 36 37 46 56

VIN: VSSZZZ1MZ3R008774 Mileage: 138340km/85960miles
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 01: Engine Labels: Redir Fail!
Part No: 038 906 012 FK
Component: 1,9l R4 EDC G000SG 3357
Coding: 00002
Shop #: WSC 06403
VSSZZZ1MZ3R008774 SEZ7Z0B1593994

2 Faults Found:
18062 - Please check DTC Memory of Instrument Cluster
P1654 - 35-00 - -
17656 - Start of Injection Timing Regulation: Control Deviation
P1248 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent
Readiness: N/A

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 03: ABS Brakes Labels: 1C0-907-37x-ASR.lbl
Part No: 1C0 907 379 K
Component: ASR FRONT MK60 0103
Coding: 0021505
Shop #: WSC 00001 001 00001

1 Fault Found:
01314 - Engine Control Module
013 - Check DTC Memory - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 08: Auto HVAC Labels: 1M0-820-043.lbl
Part No: 1M0 820 043 E
Component: 1M-CLIMATRONIC X0702
Coding: 00044
Shop #: WSC 06402

3 Faults Found:
01274 - Air Flow Flap Positioning Motor (V71)
41-10 - Blocked or No Voltage - Intermittent
00792 - A/C Pressure Switch (F129)
31-00 - Open or Short to Ground
01273 - Fresh Air Blower (V2)
17-10 - Control Difference - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 15: Airbags Labels: 6Q0-909-605-VW5.lbl
Part No: 1C0 909 605 A
Component: 39 AIRBAG VW51 0A 0004
Coding: 13113
Shop #: WSC 06441

1 Fault Found:
00532 - Supply Voltage B+
07-10 - Signal too Low - Intermittent

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 17: Instruments Labels: Redir Fail!
Part No: 1M0 920 922 D
Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V03
Coding: 05422
Shop #: WSC 00000
VSSZZZ1MZ3R008774 SEZ7Z0B1593994

1 Fault Found:
00562 - Sensor for Oil Level/Temperature (G266)
30-00 - Open or Short to Plus
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Address 46: Central Conv. Labels: 1C0-959-799.lbl
Part No: 1C0 959 799 F
Component: 7D Komfortgerát HLO 0003
Coding: 00259
Shop #: WSC 51350


2 Faults Found:
01330 - Central Control Module for Central Convenience (J393)
53-10 - Supply Voltage Too Low - Intermittent
01332 - Door Control Module; Passenger Side (J387)
53-10 - Supply Voltage Too Low - Intermittent

 

[Cupra Ross]

http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q_how_to/multi/IQadjusthammermod.htm

Try the Vag-Com adaption before using the hammer tap method. Its also possible that your actual injection timing is out. If you take the cambelt cover off you will see that the fuel pump sprocket (top right as you look at the engine side on from the driver's side wing) has an outer sprocket bolted to the inner spindle. If you loosen the bolts holding the two parts together, you can advance or retard the injection timing by moving the centre piece relative to the outer piece. More on this here: http://www.tdiclub.com/TDIFAQ/TDiFAQ-7.html#k This should sort out most of your running and performance issues.

 

[shaneseat]

many thanks ross, ill definitely be trying this so you think it could possilbly be timing? would that account for the white smoke and lumpiness this mornin, but when you drive it quite hard like i did last night its ok?

i also checked oil level and water level as thought these might have been low- poss oil pump or water pump?

 

[Cupra Ross]

Its the first thing you should check on a VE TDi if its running poorly. Smoke and lumpiness in the morning is likely to be glow plug related. They do smoke a bit when cold but looked after properly the Bosch VE equipped AHF and ASV 110TDi engines are brilliant, they are the most economical and reliable of all the 1.9TDi's in the Mk4 platform cars. No issues with camshafts like you have on the PD engines. These engines run forever. I put a Milltek decat pipe, Upsolute generic rechip and an Allard EGR bypass on my last one. It was making 150+bhp and more torque than the clutch could handle. An easy 180bhp is possible on a decat, custom map and slightly bigger injectors. It'll leave a standard LC for dead and still get 55mpg on average.

An open short on the oil level sensor usually means that the electrical connector for it (the sensor bolts into the bottom of the sump) has fallen off.

This code: 17656 - Start of Injection Timing Regulation: Control Deviation
P1248 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent is making me think that the ECU is unable to electronically trim the injection timing any further and you need to make a mechanical adjustment to the pump sprocket. Be careful when you do this and use new bolts to secure everything after you've made your final adjustments.

 

[shaneseat]

hi ross, any pics of where the sensor/wiring should be underneath? i put the car up on ramps, theres no plastic shield under there, but seen the sump and the bolt in the bottom, but cant for life of me see a sensor or even wiring under there?

 

[Cupra Ross]

If the car has an oil level sensor it'll be very obvious. Its a triangular-ish block on the outside of the bottom of the sump with an electrical connector on the back of it. My Golf GT TDi 110 had one but your Toledo may not.

Any joy with your fuelling issues?