Getting to know twinkle (my Ibiza)

[Crossthreaded]

This is continued from the thread about spares in the general discussion thread.

I went down to the dealer and bought a new sump plug this morning. Then the oil - Fuchs - arrived at midday today. Pretty good I thought, a day and a half from ordering with cheap, free, delivery traveling the length of the country! So by early afternoon I couldn't stall any longer and put my "car doing" clothes on. This is the first time I've laid a spanner on her as the dealer has been looking after her during the warranty period. (She's just coming up on 4 years old)

I've been fretting away about the sump plug. Silly really because the dealer technicians surely know what they're doing? having had to deal with stripped sump plugs in alloy sumps before, and knowing what a phaf it is, I was hoping for the best. Of course there was absolutely no problem, the plug unscrewed beautifully and the new one, after the oil had drained, went back in perfectly and torqued up to 30NM without giving me the slightest reason to worry. The oil filter screws to the front of the engine horizontally and I'd noticed that my new Mahle brand filter did not have an anti bleed down diaphragm (you can see it through the outer holes in the top of the filter if it has one. So I was delighted to find that the genuine VAG filter which I removed didn't have one either. Nice also to be able to prime the new filter before fitting - doubt if the dealer would do that. I also dropped the partial under tray to get better access to the filter but probably don't really need to though. I'll try without next time. I'm glad I went for the 5 litres of Fuchs now rather than the 4 litres of Castrol as 4 litres has taken her to just under the full mark - probably it'll be on full after standing overnight - had I gone with the Castrol I wouldn't have even had enough left to oil a bonnet hinge. I'm glad this engine holds so much oil as I think engines with turbos need a good quantity of oil to cut down on stressing the oil.

While the front was up in the air I thought I'd just clean up the brakes as they obviously hadn't been touched since she rolled off the line. The off side dismantled very nicely - after I clocked that little tab which sticks out the bottom of the caliper and locates behind the bottom carrier guide! 4 years of dust and gunge was quickly cleaned away, pads glaze busted and Cera Tec smeared sparingly about before reassembling. All going so well. N/S top guide pin unscrewed OK but felt just very slightly tight at the half way stage. Bottom guide pin? Oh dear! moved about one turn quite nicely then started to tighten up. Screwed back in and slaistered Plus Gas all over (put some on the pin too - ha ha!) Tried again but it was still a bit tight, came out though. Caliper and pads all cleaned up (pads about half gone) but on reassembly the guide pin started to tighten up almost immediately. Whipped it out and shone a bright light (cree) down the hole. Hmm, still quite a bit of thread especially further in to the hole but not in "perfect" condition. Searched all through my tap and dies box but nothing will fit - Turns out it's a metric 9 by 1.25 thread. I do have a thread file though so got the pin's thread looking lovely again with this then put a little valve grinding paste on the thread and gently, little by little, wound it in and out, in and out of the threaded hole in the hub being carefull to keep it really square on (this car doesn't have a separate caliper carrier unfortunately). After a few minutes of doing this it all started to feel much nicer so I took the slider pin out and cleaned up with some brake cleaner. Carefully reinstalled the caliper and slider pins. Top pin tightened just fine. Bottom pin? It felt a little "ropey" for the first turn and a half or so but then screwed home quite nicely. I used thread locker and my torque wrench on both pins and they both tightened up nicely so I'm confident it's OK for now - I'm not worrying about it anyway. Next time it needs to come off might be a different question though. I've been aware of the slider pin thread repair solutions (thread inserts of various designs) for some time. I think when the good weather returns I'll buy one and "sort" it properly.

With this unexpected "excitement" I ran out of time so tomorrow I'll be doing the air filter, cabin filter, cleaning up the rear brakes and generally running an eye over everything else. Oh, and fitting a headlight bulb to my daughter-in-law's Honda Jazz Mk1 - a fun job which involves partial removal of the wheel arch liner and, if I'm unlucky, loosing some blood!

 

[Crossthreaded]

Further to my last post. Anyone know for sure if the slider pin thread is definitely a M9 of 1.25 pitch? I know the pitch is 1.25 because I could check it against my thread file which is marked with the pitch sizes. I have a set of M8 by 1.25 taps and again, if you hold it up against the slider pin you can see the thread pitch is the same but the tap is slightly too small when you try it in the hole. I also notice a number of kits which feature a m9 by 1.25 thread so I'm guessing this is what it is - anyone know for sure? The car is a 2016 Ibiza 1.0 litre 95 hp Estate (ST).

 

[Crossthreaded]

By the way, the rest of the service went without a hitch. The cabin filter was as easy to do as it looked. The air filter is also easy once you realize there are two "pop off" type rubber mounts under the filter body. Once you've disconnected the breather pipe and the inlet and outlet hoses and freed the wee hard plastic pipe on the N/S - don't forget the single torx screw at the front either - you just have to be "brave" and give it a determined pull upwards, it feels as if it is still bolted down to something - it's not, just give it a good jerk. The retaining toex screws round the outside are easy to see but don't miss the one right in the middle - it "hides" down a hole!

I'm doing a bit of "exploring" with my VCDS and got a bit confused with the Service Reset (mine has a UDS set up so the simple "automated SRI" doesn't work, I have to go into adaptations. The other VAG vehicles we've had in the family weren't like this so I'm learning - doesn't look to baffling though, think I'm getting the hang of it. However I saw a you tube video on using the dash buttons to do the reset so thought you might like to know how this worked on mine?

I have the newer dash with white display (as against the older red one) and just one elongated button (00/set) in the middle below the display (under the speedo/rev counter) My display was showing that an oil change/inspection (bigger service) was due. So, what to do?
1) With ignition off press the button in and, keeping it pressed in, turn the ignition on - you don't need to start the engine. - keep the button pressed in.
2) Very soon the little display panel, in the middle between the dials, will display "Reset oil service". If you keep the button pressed, after a short while it will display "reset oil and inspection service". So up till now you have kept that button pressed all the time without releasing it.
3) In my case I wanted to reset the oil change and inspection so I kept the button pressed in through the "oil change only" display until it changed to the "oil change and inspection" display (there are only the two)
4) When the display you want (in my case oil change and inspection) is displayed, release the button and it will say "reset oil change and inspection" When you see this press and release the button to confirm and that's it. you're done.
5) If you want to double check go to your central info/radio/etc screen and push the CAR button. At the bottom of the screen you'll see SETUP. touch on this and you'll see various things you can check. scroll down 'till you see SERVICE and touch on it. Now you can see what the service reminder thinks it knows. If you've just done a reset it'll show lots if miles and 365 days.

 

[RUM4MO]

I'm surprised that the front calliper guide bolts gave trouble, I've never ever used screwlock etc of these bolts just tightened them up to a sensible torque (??Nm) I've had that calliper on a 2002 VW Polo and a late 2009 Ibiza, the tab on the bottom caught me out first time round too !

Resetting the service warning using VCDS, are you sure that you have the latest version in your laptop, I only had that issue once with the late 2009 Ibiza, so got lazy and used Carista to reset it - prior to that and before VCDS had a dedicated routine to reset it, I used to just go into adaptions and went through the locations resetting as need be.

I'm surprised that your age of Ibiza could not be reset using VCDS easily though.

The calliper fixing/guide bolt threaded points in the hub carrier is a known weak point and can end up with the threads striping, though having tended a 2002 VW Polo for 13 years and a late 2009 Ibiza for nearly 10 years, both cars survived okay. I first cleaned up the brakes after year 2 to play safe.

 

[Crossthreaded]

Good morning RUM. Yes I too was surprised to have problems with the guide pin (it's really only the bottom one that's being naughty) I must have done hundreds of similar ones during my working life and, as you say, they rarely are problematic. With the advantage of hindsight I think what happened was that it picked up in the thread as it was removed. Close examination of the thread on the pin showed an imperfection right on the end of the thread which I think has been the root cause - now corrected with the thread file. Maybe this imperfection was there from when it was built (I could see this sort of damage having been caused during manufacture by the component falling into a storage bin at just the wrong angle and "denting" the start of the thread - or maybe, less likely though, it was slightly cross threaded on original assembly). It came out without too much force being exerted but has left the thread not quite "perfect". However it torqued up quite happily to the recommended 28NM (FS111 calipers) and seems to be nice and secure. It's only because I'm a bit of a perfectionist - and worrier - that I'll definitely be doing a helicoil - or maybe time sert, never done a time sert but like the look of them - to restore the thread to 100% functionality when the better weather gets here in the spring. It looks very accessible too, once the disc is out of the way, so shouldn't be a difficult job. Just a bit gutted to have this happen on such a new car. If my assessment of the cause is correct I can console myself that it's not something that could have been forestalled by dismantling any sooner though - So I mustn't beat myself up for not having laid a finger on her during her warranty period. She'll be getting a yearly going over from here on in.

Regarding liquid thread locker - genuine Loctite being my brand of choice - I like to use Blue Thread Locker, so the one that's intended to be later removed - as against the stronger red "Stud Lock", on many safety critical fixings. I find it makes little difference when it comes to removal but definitely protects against things vibrating free. Makes me feel happy anyway!

Not having experimented much with my VCDS I too was surprised the "simple" way didn't work. I've been chatting with Grant at Gendan and he seems to think I'll need to go into adaptions. However I'll stop by AVW next time I'm out that way and ask Allan or Keith (it was Allan who so kindly offered to show me last time I asked). As the "button pushing" exercise was entirely successful it's not urgent but I'd like to know anyway.

 

[RUM4MO]

Resetting service warning using VCDS in "the old days" there was never a simple "one click" service warning thing - or is that SRI or similar description, you just went into instruments - adaption and worked your way down through all the channels, each one comes with its own description so nothing can go wrong (famous last words) - I thought that after my first failed attempt on that late 2009 Ibiza, I managed to do it next time round - maybe not, so maybe VCDS never ever got round to sorting that out for these later Ibizas - being a bit "keen" I used to log all the channel "contents" prior to zeroing them or setting them to 365 (days) and 10000 (miles) - why I did that I can't say, just logged them all for ----. Luckily this newer "one click" service warning reset has freed me up from doing that, but I'm sure there is an option to save and print out all that data offered after doing the reset. Only one thing you can mess up is not actually resetting this service warning, so you need to pay attention to what the VCDS screen is saying to you, I seem to remember getting a bit annoyed when I next switched the ignition on, the warning was still there! I paid more attention to what exactly VCDS was "saying" to me from then on!

One thing about using Loctite is, it should keep any curd from getting in through the "back" of the calliper hole. When I worked, we used to need to need to deal with (government) customers messing about with the kit we supplied and that seemed to, for some strange reason mean too many simple "screw + single coil washer + plain washer" was helped along with all that plus green Loctite - so that always meant total strip down of boxes and a lot of spark erosion - so lots more cost and time spent - which was tax payers we all paid for - very very silly really!

Repairing that thread in the calliper, if you really think it needs repairing, have you ever come across these "top hat" repair inserts for exactly that type of application

Just one thing, can you work out if your Ibiza has FS111 or Mando front callipers? I'd hope that this sort of thing would now have happened to a car with FS111 callipers, so I'm guessing that your car has Mando front callipers - progress? If the build date for your car is 26/05/15 or later, unfortunately it will have Mando front callipers!

 

[Crossthreaded]

Thanks RUM - lots of good interesting stuff there. The slightly strange thing is that the one on the offside came apart and went back together splendidly - just as one might expect of a vehicle that's only just coming up on 4 years old with low mileage.

The Time Sert, made by Wurth, is a sort of cross between a helicoil and one of those top hat inserts you speak of. See this for explanation: https://www.amazon.com/TIME-SERT-Metric-Thread-Repair-1912/dp/B001ZS9VHO The difference is that the time sert is a solid "plug", rather than the helical wire of a helicoil, but it's hole has to be tapped and the insert is then screwed in and locked in place. I've seen them used on repairs to ally cylinder heads, manifolds etc and very good they are too. I've not used the "top hat" type mounts but I understand they are pressed into a smooth hole - the insert is splined on it's outside face so it will grip the hole - and the "brim" of the "top hat" then stops it being pulled right through the hole. See this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/BGS-Replac...ocphy=1007326&hvtargid=pla-428826951268&psc=1 I like the idea of this. It seems to me it would be a simple process to carry out and, if damage happened to the thread again at some later date, the insert could probably be knocked out with a punch and a new one installed, maybe with a wee dash of bearing lock fluid?

Ok, my car was first reg March 2016, so Mondo calipers? What should I look for to verify/identify? You seem to be implying that the Mondo caliper is less desirable? I'd be interested to know why - they just looked like typical single piston slide type calipers from what I observed, I wasn't looking for maker's marks etc - far too busy feeling annoyed at that slide pin.

Oh, and can anyone verify the M9 by 1.25mm pitch thread size on this?

 

[RUM4MO]

I'd think that you would need to check the diameter and thread pitch with pitch checking gauge as the current official VW Group spares listings have stopped including that in the description unfortunately.

My comments about Mando were only a typical older person's maybe ignorant view of newer "overseas" suppliers - other groups than VW Group will not doubt be using them now, just the way things go as do doubt they are offering car makers a far cheaper option when sourcing parts.

Put it this way, I'm guessing that if given the choice, you would have replaced ATE callipers, ie in your case FS111 model with ATE ones and not gone down the cheaper road of just buying in a Mando calliper, if your car came with ATE (FS111) front callipers and needed one replaced.

Maybe with time we will all change our minds about these newer companies, or at least these newer suppliers into European new cars.

Edit:- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mando_Corporation

 

[Crossthreaded]

Thanks for that RUM, Mando was not a name I'd heard before, but then there are lots of names now replacing the names I knew and trusted in the past.

The only thing I really have against these ones is that the guide pins screw directly into the hub. If you've got to do it that way I'd prefer to have a separate caliper carrier bracket like those on wee Becky. (But I know, before you say it, They are saving at least 2/6p per caliper by doing it this way!) The ones I like best are the ones where the slide pins slide in the carrier and the caliper is secured to the slide pins by bolts - like those on the rear.

I realize I'm beginning to give voice to the sort of things my trainees used to say all those years ago when I was a trainer. Typically, having had difficulty with a training exercise, the question would be asked of me "why on earth did they make it that way. Wouldn't it have been better to have been like this?" (often the language would be more colourful). I would often point out that this mindset is hopeless because it is what it is - our task is to take it for what it is and "fix" it.

 

[RUM4MO]

I agree completely, where the open end of the threaded holes these guide bolts fit into is in a very nasty environment so no wonder these parts can end up failing, but I'd think with regular servicing of these brakes that would not become an issue, I'd think most of the times people end up with stripping out the threads will be on cars that have only ever had these bolts removed to replace worn out pads and the "operator" has been very heavy handed - ie doing the job very quickly like a tyre/brake/exhaust "specialist" needs to do!

I certainly always wire brushed the bolt threads, used brake cleaner and a green scrubber pad to get the barrels spotless, then applied a spot of silicon grease, before refitting them - and not over torqueing them.

I'm also guessing that I have an M9 X ?.??mm tap and die just in case I feel the need to clean up the threads.

Edit:- correction no dies in garage tool drawers only proper quality taps and the M9 is a 1.25mm pitch one! I have a full set of cheapish taps and dies elsewhere in the house - a huge set in a wooden box, from Screwfix as that set covers fine and coarse metric threads for tidying up used bolts and old threaded holes! (the beauty of being retired and having found time to make a list of all my garage tools - avoids buying too many new ones!)