Clutch pedal causing wiring FIRE and sudden braking!!

[greg]

My girlfriend was coming off the motorway the other day and just as she was changing down from 5th to 4th gear when she put the clutch in the car slowed down rapidly (as if someone had put the handbrake on as she describes it), and smoke started coming from the steering column. The recovery guy came and said that some of the loom had caught fire under the steering column, and he then towed her to a garage for the car to be assessed by the insurance company. The insurance company said as its an electrical fault she isn’t covered and they reckon it will cost £750 to repair (although they didn’t tell us exactly what they determined was the cause or indeed what exactly needed to be repaired or replaced).

Anyway, my girlfriend cant afford £750 so I have volunteered to give it a go . I have removed the dash and this is what I found. It appears that a part of the loom (a cluster of about 20 – 30 wires) has been getting pinched by the top of the clutch pedal when the clutch cable goes through the firewall. This has either caused one of the wires to become exposed and short out on the body or the wires have just become very warm and set light to the surrounding tape. On first inspection I cannot see any bare wire so I think the latter may be the case. Also, Fuses number 1 (Engine/Engine Electronics) and 4 (Ignition Transformer) are burnt out.

The cable that is damaged runs from the big bank of connectors on the drivers side behind the fuse box, across behind the pedals and the main air channel in the centre of the dash and then disappears behind the blower unit that sits behind the glovebox. Does anyone know what this cable could be? Or even where it is likely to be entering the car? (I cant work out if its coming from behind the blower motor from the battery and then to the bank of connectors, or if it comes in by the connectors and then is running out to the fan unit).

Also, could a short circuit have caused the car to brake suddenly like it did?

Any help would really be appreciated!!!!

Thanks Guys,

Greg

 

[greg]

Here are the links to the pictures.............

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/album.php?albumid=526&pictureid=1479

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/album.php?albumid=526&pictureid=1481

 

[lemonslap]

Sorry to hear this mate glad your girlfriend is ok! On of the wires would of controlled the throttle (no cable on these controlled buy the ecu) so this would of snapped shut or the engine just died causing this effect.If you need any help or wiring diagrams post back mate

 

[greg]

Yes please mate im in desperate need of some wiring diagrams!!!! I've searched the net and this forum but to no avail If you can help mate id be eternally grateful!!!

 

[greg]

Forgot to mention its an X reg 1.4 Ibiza Cool (8V i think), not sure on the engine code but could find out if needed.

 

[greg]

Come on guys, you all moan when someone asks another N249 question, but as soon as i ask something new you're all silent

Any info at all would be really helpful, such as....................

1. Where does the wiring from the engine bay pass through the firewall to the interior?
2. What components are connected to fuses 1 and 4?
3. If the fire only occurred due to the heat from the wires igniting the grease covered tape around them, causing the wires to become very hot but not completely burnt, would this (a) cause the fuses in that circuit to melt and (b) render those wires unusable for the future?

Cheers

 

[m0rk]

It's weird - if the car caught fire, her insurance company would have paid out.

Have a look on the fuse cover, I'm sure that will tell you what the fuse covers

However - to repair the wiring, remove the wire wrapping & cut out the offending damaged wiring.

 

[greg]

Hi Mork, thanks for the reply. Yeah thats what annoys me, if the car had burnt to the ground she would have got a nice pay out, but because its only damaged components and there were no external contributing factors, the damage is not covered, even tho she was fully comp!!!

I was thinkin the same thing about cutting out the burnt sections of wiring and replacing it but on closer inspection the wires themselves look fine and its just the outer tape (which was covered on oil/grease from the clutch pedal) which appears to have burnt. Would you advise still checking the whole length of wires for burn damage and electrical continuity? That is of course if i can work out where the on earth they go!!!

 

[m0rk]

Just looking at the picture of the clutch cable holder, that looks wonky - has it sliced into the cables?

 

[greg]

Well that was my initial thought. The wires are supposed to go behind this bracket i think as they are cable tied to another cluster of wires behind the bracket and this tie is pulling them under the bracket every time the clutch is pressed. then when the clutch is released they are pinched between the clutch pedal bracket and that bronze bracket you can also see in the pic. I thought the pinching action had cut through one of the wires causing it to short on the metal.

However, I have now removed all of the burnt tape from the wires and the wires appear absolutely fine. This lead me to believe that maybe the fire was just cause by the oil/grease heating up and catching light, as at the time the cable would have been pinched between the two bits of metal and thus could have not dissipated heat as well as it should.

 

[Ibiza125]

If I were you, I would clean it up, check the wires (like you have already done), wrap it with electrical tape, tuck the wires out of the way, and see how you get on with that. Oh and obviously replace all the blown fuses

 

[BHP Addict]

Firstly, glad she's ok mate.

Put up another pic of what it looks like now you have cleaned it up a bit mate.

I would suggest removing the tape for about a foot either side of the fire and checking the wires there. If no damage then I would be tempted to cut out at least 6 inches either side of the fire (1 foot in total) and replace with new cable. Allow the new cables to be slightly longer so you can relocate it o a safer position (Even if the wiring seems ok, I wouldn't trust it TBH - rather safe than sorry).

 

[AlexGSi2000]

Thats really unfortunate, but lucky the whole car didn't go up.

As others have said really, id cut out the damaged wiring and replace.

Keep us updated.

 

[greg]

Cheers for all the replies guys think i will definitely splice in new wiring to replace the burnt stuff and re-route it so that it doesnt happen again. Do you think it is worth trying to find out where the wires go so that i can check the complete wire and the components it supplies or just repair the bits i can get too then put the dash back on and see if it works?

 

[AlexGSi2000]

Id just repair the damaged wiring Greg.
If the replaced wire joins to the same wire it was originally connected to I wouldn't see the need.

If the fuses blew, it would have offered some protection to the components the wiring fed, if not, I guess you will only find out when you've repaired the wiring.

 

[BHP Addict]

Check the wiring a good distance from the wires.

In fact, if you get the fuse board out, check the connections that the fuses go into. If they are ok, I would just do what I advised above mate. Not too difficult just takes time. Definatly re-route though!

 

[greg]

I can trace the wires right back to the big bank of connectors that sit behind the fusebox (and behind all the big relays), but after the bank of connectors all of the wires kind of merge into a cluster of about 100+ wires .lol. So cant check them right up to the fusebox. I think Im gonna check all of the wiring i can access between the bank of connectors and where it dissappears behind the air blower motor (about 3-4foot) and then replace about a foot or so around the burnt area if the rest appears fine. Like you suggested as well BHPAddict, it would definitely be a good idea to check around the fuses just to be sure none of that has become burnt.

Thanks again Lads

 

[philsip]

this should in intresting, i had this problem when i fitted a radio to my landrover county, when i was 13 years old lol, the wires coming from under the seat to the radio! very dodgy i guess now, but which is better when its 2002 and sandstorm is playing on the radio

none the less, the positive and negative on the radio shorted together and had a smoke section on the go!

 

[greg]

Got my mechanic mate round to look at the wires last night and he agreed that its best to replace all of them. He then proceeded to hack through the lot in one go and pull them out, thinking they would be individually marked. They mainly are all individual except there are 2 cases where 3 wires are identical! 3 are yellow with a black stripe and another 3 are green with a black stripe. Anyone know what this colour coding stands for?

It appears that the part of the loom i have just cut runs just from the positive battery terminal to the fuse box, so would i be right in thinking that i can connect any of the same colour wires to each other as long as they use the same gauge?

 

[tom w]

i think there is a lesson to be learnt here ! when dealing with cables cut them one at a time ! trust me i am a sparky i deal with cables every day!