Autoleads speaker adaptors

[TonyC]

The standard speakers in our Altea sound dire (I've tried all sorts of combinations of bass, mid & treble settings, but still pants).

Searching through the forum & reading the very instructive guides people have written thumbup: Thanks guys), I've decided to replace the speakers.

I was going to get a set of the Autoleads SAK-3103 speaker adaptors, but I notice they now list the (new for 2006) SAK-3108 for the Golf Mk V.

As the Altea is more closely related to the Golf V, I wondered if these would need less modification - or even none .

Has anyone tried them, or actually seen them ?

Cheers, Tony.

 

[Tell]

It was I that found the Golf IV adaptor kit could be hacked to size. It's nothing really just cutting a piece of plastic lip so they fit down flush in the door else they don't and you'd never get the speaker grill back on.... err I tried.

The Golf IV ones are more in a tube which the speakers mount into, that picture of the Golf V shows that it doesn't have a tube and the question again is whether the diameter of the, the outside edge is too big to get in. If so you would be cutting it down to size in anycase. The tube may give it a bit more whether proofing and it's more what the original speakers are in.

SAK-3108:

http://caraudiosecurity.com/shop/product/products_id/2403.html

SAK-3103 [with the tube]:

Right, since I'm in a practical frame of mind at the minute I've been out to the car and taken the speaker grill off. You would have a problem with the Golf V ones since the adaptor kit bolt into the car in the inside screws as I can make out from the quick look and that is sunk inside the door, the speakers screw into the outside holes of the AUTOLEADS-SAK-3103, so the AUTOLEADS-SAK-3103 is perfect except from a bit of plastic you have to trim off which is evident.

The SAK-3108 has no tube / lip on it so you screws would be waving around by an inch or so.

I'd get the speakers with the sweet spot adjustment as well .

I'll just check Loadswine photos but you can, since they will show how it all comes together.

OK my index to the project:

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/showthread.php?t=76991&highlight=buzzy [or one of them]

Right down the bottom of here are Loadswine pictures when he did it.

http://www.seatcupra.net/forums/t76991-p3-buzzy-altea-speakers-and-ice-upgrade.html

So yeah, you'd have the threads of your screws waving around the distance of that tube so it must be a better fit to have the tube and have it bolted down into the original position and the speakers mounted in the tube as designed rather than on a slim piece of plastic, and that's assuming that all the screw holes measure up and if you still had to cut it no gain, but a loss in the flimsy fit.

 

[Tell]

oh and I think the SAK-3108 doesn't have enough screw holes so they won't line up to the Altea's even if it was the right dimention since we're looking for four screw holes not five as in that one. If you look at Loadswine picture below the thread positions of the screws to bolt in and to hold the speaker are at the same radius out, the SAK-3108 ones aren't so basically it's not much good !. You got eight holes, which alternate, the ones recessed go into the existing thread uysed by the speakers that you are taking out and the others bolt in the speakers you putting in. My considered view.

Don't ask how I found the Golf IV and why that was any good, I just looked at the pictures of it at the time and thought, err that will probably do the job, and it did.

 

[Magnus]

Jumping in here with both feet.

Hope I didn't catch anybody's toes.

Been lurking here for a while and picked up some great info so now it's time return the favour.

After I decided the speakers in my Altea had to go I spoke to a local ICE specialist about adaptors. They contacted Kenwood who supplied some short plastic tubes (in Kenwood packaging - no part numbers) which turned out to be ones supplied for the new Beetle and Lupo. True to their word they fitted my Altea.
Depth is a bit tight. I measured the front clearance with the (window down), but not the rears . Rectified this with a home-made 6mm MDF spacer ring.

Fitted some JBL GTO6527 as budget was a bit tight, but no regrets. Going by appearance JBL seem to use similar components to the Infinitys others have used on here (both brands owned by the same company).

Cheers
Magnus

 

[Tell]

Ah well noted what you said about the back windows, but the good news is that the Golf IV Audioleads SAK-3103 isn't too long for the back windows - so they fit all doors except that lip that you trim off with a hacksaw.

Paul [Alteaego as I recall] at the time talked about MDF spacer rings but that was over my head . What annoyed me was the complete dis-information from Pioneer who had the Altea listed in their brochure, bought the ones listed for it, which didn't fit and they then said then the ones I needed were out of stock and not made. That's when I started to look at VW Speaker Adaptor kits and spotted the Golf IV ones and took a gamble. Becuase of me a fair proportion of Altea are being driven around with the Audioleads kit and Infinity Speakers . The latter I installed on my ZX which I was delighted with but went up an inch or so with the ones I installed on the Altea which gives a better base responce.

I think if you are getting rid of the inbuilt speakers which is the thing to do since the crossover is crap and I guess that the inbuilt speakers are just as cheap and nasty as the Philips paper ones, then you need speakers with the sweet spot adjustement ie. you can move the tweeter cone. Accepting that I have moaned about the positioning of the tweaters in the car relative to the front and back, not that I spent a misplaced youth in clubs of disrepute ... which had very large sound systems and podium dancers but I've yet to get them installed in the car - LOL. You could keep the whistle in the ashtray....

 

[TonyC]

OK, thanks Tell & Magnus.

I can now see from the larger pictures that the Golf V adaptors are unsuitable - it was difficult to tell from the small images on the Autoleads site.

I wasn't planning on getting the Infinity 652.7i's, as the impedance is 2 ohms & I doubt the head unit can sustain a high output current. I think the older versions you have are 4 ohms

None of the cheaper speakers list on the caraudiosecurity site appear to have adjustable tweeters (or are 16 or 17cm), so I'll probably stick with the standard-fit ones (I assume the crossover - probably just a capacitor - is in the tweeter assembly somewhere & that I'd have to take the door panel off to get to it to upgrade).

Plus it's my wife's car, so I don't want the sound to be better than mine - or I'll have to upgrade that too

The JBL's Magnus has chosen look OK, but I'll disconnect the tweeters & use them as bass/mid only.

 

[Tell]

OK, thanks Tell & Magnus.

I can now see from the larger pictures that the Golf V adaptors are unsuitable - it was difficult to tell from the small images on the Autoleads site.

I wasn't planning on getting the Infinity 652.7i's, as the impedance is 2 ohms & I doubt the head unit can sustain a high output current. I think the older versions you have are 4 ohms

None of the cheaper speakers list on the caraudiosecurity site appear to have adjustable tweeters (or are 16 or 17cm), so I'll probably stick with the standard-fit ones (I assume the crossover - probably just a capacitor - is in the tweeter assembly somewhere & that I'd have to take the door panel off to get to it to upgrade).

Plus it's my wife's car, so I don't want the sound to be better than mine - or I'll have to upgrade that too

The JBL's Magnus has chosen look OK, but I'll disconnect the tweeters & use them as bass/mid only.

Loadswine is using the newer 2 ohm ones and hasn't reported a problem, so I wouldn't worry. It's a good headend. Don't think there is much difference between 2 and 4 ohm said by someone who just installing their new cooker.

Good question on the crossover, it must be on the tweeter in the door since I don't think it's in the Philips speakers. I gave them away. The lead is just wired in pararell.

Now it's suppose to be a two hour job per door to take the doors apart, to get at the tweeters, nobody on here has reported that they have done it, hence why nobody is bothering to change the tweeters. Mostly disconnect them.

I think I follow the logic on the JBL speakers but you may be saying the reverse of what I'd do, disconnect the cars tweeters by just not connecting that loop wire and use the inbuilt tweeters in the JBL ones, that's assuming it's got some. Think it did from the picture I looked at last night, these will be a thousand times better than the ones in the door I'm sure. Still I'll put in the Infinity ones in myself.

No sign of Loadswine commenting, he's probably on holiday, but he was very happy with the latest 2 ohm speakers.

 

[Magnus]

Ah well noted what you said about the back windows, but the good news is that the Golf IV Audioleads SAK-3103 isn't too long for the back windows - so they fit all doors except that lip that you trim off with a hacksaw.

The Beetle adaptors look very similar to yours (minus lip) but are probably just a bit shallower. If I had chosen a shallower mount speaker for the rear then the job would have been a whole lot easier.

Paul [Alteaego as I recall] at the time talked about MDF spacer rings but that was over my head.
8< SNIP
Becuase of me a fair proportion of Altea are being driven around with the Audioleads kit and Infinity Speakers. The latter I installed on my ZX which I was delighted with but went up an inch or so with the ones I installed on the Altea which gives a better base responce.

Yours (and Pauls) experience and advice, in colour with pictures were invaluable to me, especialy about which wires to cut to kill those damn stupid tweeters.
I adden my ten pence worth just so that anyone reading that wants the easiest upgrade route on a budget knows it can be done. ANY coaxial speaker from a well-known manufacturer would be better than the original speaker's muddy sound. My budget was £100, and I only went over that by using self adhesive foam to stop any air leaks or possible rattles. A habit from my DIY Hi-Fi speaker days.

I think if you are getting rid of the inbuilt speakers which is the thing to do since the crossover is crap and I guess that the inbuilt speakers are just as cheap and nasty as the Philips paper ones, then you need speakers with the sweet spot adjustement ie. you can move the tweeter cone. Accepting that I have moaned about the positioning of the tweaters in the car relative to the front and back, not that I spent a misplaced youth in clubs of disrepute... which had very large sound systems and podium dancers but I've yet to get them installed in the car - LOL. You could keep the whistle in the ashtray....

The original speakers are sooo crap that I don't think I can bring myself to put them back in when I sell, no matter how crap the deal I get in trade in.

Magnus

 

[Magnus]

None of the cheaper speakers list on the caraudiosecurity site appear to have adjustable tweeters (or are 16 or 17cm), so I'll probably stick with the standard-fit ones (I assume the crossover - probably just a capacitor - is in the tweeter assembly somewhere & that I'd have to take the door panel off to get to it to upgrade).

The JBL's Magnus has chosen look OK, but I'll disconnect the tweeters & use them as bass/mid only.

My JBLs have a very similar tweeter to the Infinitys. You twist them round to point the right way. Plus they have the +3db boost switch, which I found helped with the speakers being down by my ankles. The crossover is a basic low/high pass filter attached to the connector area.
As Tell has advised, cut those original tweeters off, they are ruining the sound by their positioning.

I compared the JBLs side by side with some Infiitys ( not Kappas) and the similarities were amazing for speakers costing over 50% more. The two brands are owned by the same company (Harman International AKA Harman Kardon) and so are probably made in the same factory from similar parts. From just looking I can't tell whether the guts (magnets, wiring, etc.) are the same, I suspect not, but the sound is pretty good.

Magnus

 

[Tell]

They are probably both made in China . Do the JBLs claim to have the bass extension, it's an Infinity patended way or patent pending of putting extra cone into the speaker by rippling the materiel.

On the continent full sized home Infinity speakers are sold amongst all the other top names in HiFi stores, you don't see them in this country, well I haven't. Harman Kardon go back donkeys years in HiFi terms.

PS I too use to make my own speakers, I nearly let on where the bass / treble speakers came from [LOL], but lets say it was a place where things went for repair "the 18:14 is all stops too London"... I did buy tweeters from Tandys since tweeters are not installed on these things, and they are still serviceable in the Kitchen and Bedroom but I've got Mission elsewhere and Castle Trents, proper HiFi speakers, you know how the partner makes you change your ways, they brought the concept of decent HiFi and not making your own. Saying that bolting on different speakers to the Altea certainly makes a difference from the mushy sound that the inbuilt ones delivered. I tried to pretend they were OK for two months but then decided they were crap.

The Salif Keita remix of Moffou is a club mix and the Phillips speakers just made it sound terrible. You only need to listen to the deconstruction of the sound on those mixes, if you then put it through poor speakers it sounds rubbish, decent speakers and it's amazing. It was this CD that made me change the speakers.

http://www.cduniverse.com/search/xx/music/pid/6681200/a/Remixes+From+Moffou.htm

 

[Magnus]

They are probably both made in China . Do the JBLs claim to have the bass extension, it's an Infinity patended way or patent pending of putting extra cone into the speaker by rippling the materiel.

They Have "Plus One" cones which also feature on the Infinitys. I think this just means they have squeezed a larger cone into a small basket. Descriptions for the tweeters are the same as lower end Infinitys. As I said budget was everything. If I was spending 300 quid on speakers they would be a new pair of KEFs for the lounge.

On the continent full sized home Infinity speakers are sold amongst all the other top names in HiFi stores, you don't see them in this country, well I haven't. Harman Kardon go back donkeys years in HiFi terms.

Had wondered why Infinity Hi-Fi speakers don't feature in shops here. I guess a company will place a brand where it will do best in their opinion. They seem to promote JBL as a loud "headbangers" brand here, but I've heard them sound prety good in the right system.

PS I too use to make my own speakers, I nearly let on where the bass / treble speakers came from [LOL], but lets say it was a place where things went for repair "the 18:14 is all stops too London"... I did buy tweeters from Tandys since tweeters are not installed on these things, and they are still serviceable in the Kitchen and Bedroom but I've got Mission elsewhere and Castle Trents, proper HiFi speakers, you know how the partner makes you change your ways, they brought the concept of decent HiFi and not making your own. Saying that bolting on different speakers to the Altea certainly makes a difference from the mushy sound that the inbuilt ones delivered. I tried to pretend they were OK for two months but then decided they were crap.

Used to "liberate" speakers from all over the place; jumble sales, junk yards, school . I gave up making my own when I heard a freinds system (Armstrong amp with Monitor Audio MA4s) and realised I would have to get a job (was a poor student at the time) before achieving that kind of sound quality.

The Salif Keita remix of Moffou is a club mix and the Phillips speakers just made it sound terrible. You only need to listen to the deconstruction of the sound on those mixes, if you then put it through poor speakers it sounds rubbish, decent speakers and it's amazing. It was this CD that made me change the speakers.
http://www.cduniverse.com/search/xx/music/pid/6681200/a/Remixes+From+Moffou.htm

The thing that made my mind up to upgrade was listening to Dusk by The The. Such a finely recorded album, but I couldn't hear half of it.

I digress: Now, who's fitted am aux adapter to their head unit. Where's that new thread button...

 

[Tell]

If you find the aux adapter thread let me . I got an MD changer plugged into mine which I gave the info out on that one. The others have got mostly their IPODs connected via interfaces.

No, these were railway speakers that my Dad use to find scrapped in the skip so he'd say.... was a poor ex student then with a big morgage and so I built my own, cabinets from a shop in Tottenham, I use to lug them home, speaker insulation, roofing felt etc and so forth. Still you get to know about crossovers and they did use to publish these things in the mags at the time.

Dusk by The The, no I think I would have turned it off before listening to it, just checked it out, not clubby enough, world music or jazzy enough for me . My favourite tracks I put through the Infinity speakers in the car is the DVD sound track to Kraftwerk Minimum - Maximum and Nils Petter Molvaer live DVD sound track, those and the remixed Salif Keita take the speakers on an audio tour which those Phillips ones could never handle and as I've said before on that thread this arrangement is the only time when I can tell the difference between a CD being played and an MD which is saying something for the Altea equipment with the speaker upgrade.

 

[Magnus]

If you find the aux adapter thread let me . I got an MD changer plugged into mine which I gave the info out on that one. The others have got mostly their IPODs connected via interfaces.

I don't want to buy an IPod. Too proprietary and restrictive. I'd like to buy a Creative somethingorother to carry my music on, or even better, a device that acts like a CD changer, but with a hard drive and designed so that the whole thing can be bolted down out of sight.

Dusk by The The, no I think I would have turned it off before listening to it, just checked it out, not clubby enough, world music or jazzy enough for me . My favourite tracks I put through the Infinity speakers in the car is the DVD sound track to Kraftwerk Minimum - Maximum and Nils Petter Molvaer live DVD sound track, those and the remixed Salif Keita take the speakers on an audio tour which those Phillips ones could never handle and as

Dusk is their bleakest album. Infected (Slow Train To Dawn) or Soul Mining (Giant) have their lighter monents. Currently listening to some Talvin Singh that has somehow found its way onto my computer from my partner's collection .

 

[Tell]

Oh well Paul [Altea Ego ?] who fitted speakers to the Altea before me fitted a Kenwood [as I recall] HD changer under the passenger seat. Perhaps Paul may show up. I have used MDs for a while now and the compression is better than MP3 although you can feel embarresed waving them around as high technology and my Sony MD changer fits in the foot on the left in that recess, so the lower boot can still be got at, it hinges past.

It's the head end convertor box which is the issue with whatever you fix since it has to convert the protocol used by the headend to control the CD changer into the one that you are fitting. I'm sure you know all that. The Altea / New Toledo are the same as the Golf V / Toureg etc so if you see something listed for them in controlling the device of your dreams then you know it will work for the Altea.

 

[loadswine]

Loadswine is using the newer 2 ohm ones and hasn't reported a problem, so I wouldn't worry. It's a good headend. Don't think there is much difference between 2 and 4 ohm said by someone who just installing their new cooker.

Good question on the crossover, it must be on the tweeter in the door since I don't think it's in the Philips speakers. I gave them away. The lead is just wired in pararell.

Now it's suppose to be a two hour job per door to take the doors apart, to get at the tweeters, nobody on here has reported that they have done it, hence why nobody is bothering to change the tweeters. Mostly disconnect them.

I think I follow the logic on the JBL speakers but you may be saying the reverse of what I'd do, disconnect the cars tweeters by just not connecting that loop wire and use the inbuilt tweeters in the JBL ones, that's assuming it's got some. Think it did from the picture I looked at last night, these will be a thousand times better than the ones in the door I'm sure. Still I'll put in the Infinity ones in myself.

No sign of Loadswine commenting, he's probably on holiday, but he was very happy with the latest 2 ohm speakers.

I've just seen this thread, spot on Tell, I was on holiday.
The 2ohm impedance of the speakers hasn't given me any issues, probably makes it sound louder if anything.
The best mod you can do to the Altea for the money and easy to reverse if you have to.
Talking of adaptors, just seen these on ebay
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SEAT-Altea-Sp...82QQihZ010QQcategoryZ1498QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
The ready made item by the look of things and might do someone a turn if they are thinking about this mod.

The Moffou track is a cracking track to try the setup with!!

 

[Tell]

Why did I convert you to club mix Salif Keita aka Moffou, Loadswine or were you already positioned there ? .

http://www.cduniverse.com/search/xx/music/pid/6681200/a/Remixes+From+Moffou.htm

It is a very defiant mix which makes the original speakers sound like crap. I always have this positioned as #2 on my MD changers and keep the audio DVD sound track of Kraftwerk's Live Concert Min - Maximum at #5, #6 which again takes you off into some weird experinces [also available on CD, amazing how 50+ year old blokes have re-mapped their original 70s / 80s music with Germanic love parade beats and take them off into trance and just look cool and the people liked it as well, never too sure whether Sellafield is a celebration of nucleur fuel now - LOL - those peskey atoms getting out of control in the mix...] and I keep Nils Petter Molvær Live DVD audio sound track on another number when I haven't switched it out:

http://www.amazon.de/Nils-Petter-Molvaer-Live/dp/B00007J4WA

They all sort of exhibit how well the Infinity Speakers work and the headend, but the Remix Moffou is so weird it's sounds crap on the original Altea speakers .

BTW, back on topic, perhaps I should get commission on who ever is selling that kit, lovely hack saw job LOL.

 

[loadswine]

Yes Tell, it was your suggestion that encouraged the musical choice!
When I did the speaker swap, it was like hearing the CDs for the first time again, hearing instruments that I hadn't picked up on before and a better rendition of the dynamics in the music.