Air in clutch lines?

[AntneeUK]

Help point me in the right direction guys...

We've just been away for a week in the wife's 1.4S and I left the LCR with a friend. He had to move the car while I was away and he said the clutch felt really sharp. I didn't know what he meant until I tried to pull off and the biting point was pretty much on the floor. I didn't have to lift much further before it was fully engaged and then the pedal seemed to sit low.

I was convinced that there was something seriously wrong with it. I know the two cars are actually quite different, despite being based on the same platform but I was sure that they weren't that different. It was only just over a week since I'd last driven it, surely I hadn't forgotten what it drove like already?

Anyway, down the road and it felt really wrong. The pedal wasn't coming up very far at all, although it did come the rest of the way up eventually, it just didn't seem to have much pressure behind it for that last bit of lift.

I vaguely recall problems with a master cylinder mounting bracket (right?) but nothing appears to have broken. After pumping it for a while it seemed much better and by the time I'd been for petrol and gone home it seemed almost as I remember. So I either got used to it quickly or using it sorted it.

It seems very much like there's air in the system to me, and am I right in saying that the brake and clutch system are on the same fluids? After my callipers were refurbished we had a lot of problems getting the air out so I'm now wondering if it's related and would appreciate some more experienced thoughts.

Cheers guys

 

[AntneeUK]

Oh, and is there any chance at all that this could have any relation to my apparent inability to select second gear when accelerating hard? Happened a couple of times before but happened again today, embarrassingly in front of a large group of people at a car wash

 

[vwbassett]

The car wasnt moved and then ragged around by your friend was it
Clutch does share the fluid from the same resevoir so it could be part of the issue following the the brake bleed and as it isnt much hassle to bleed id try that if not possibly leaky clutch cylinder seals.

 

[AntneeUK]

Ha ha, no, I dropped it off running on vapour and he didn't even have the money to put fuel in his own car so I know he wouldn't have been out in mine

It feels as good as it was at the moment, so I'm sure it's something like air that's causing the problem. Does it need to be bled under pressure?

 

[sheffboy]

hate to say it mate but I think your master cylinder has given up the ghost. Failing that it could be the slave (£££'s)

I've had two master cylinders and slave cylinder in mine since I've owned it and the symptoms are exactly as you've described. Very common on the Leon also.

If its the master cylinder it wont be too expensive but if its the slave its located in the clutch housing and costs a fair bit in labour (unless you can diy) if your on the original clutch you may aswell get that changed while your at it.

Hope i'm wrong mate.

 

[vwbassett]

Personally id do the fluid first as you will need the gunson eezibleeder or other pressure bleeder either way and whats the cost of half a litre of cheap fluid. Then if necessary do the cylinders - simple job just tight for space and are about £30 each.

 

[AntneeUK]

Nice, one, cheers guys. It seems pretty much as it was again now, but the fact that if it's left for a week it goes I reckon something is wrong. I'm in no mad rush while it's OK, but I'll check it soon.

Thanks again

 

[sheffboy]

mine would feel fine for a while then go through a period of the clutch biting point being close to the floor.

After a few weeks it got so bad I had to lift the clutch pedal back up with my toe. If I pumped the pedal a few times it all seemed fine again but it was only a temporary fix

deffo try the fluid thing first though like vwbassett suggested. got my fingers crossed for you fella.

 

[l.e.star]

mine would feel fine for a while then go through a period of the clutch biting point being close to the floor.

After a few weeks it got so bad I had to lift the clutch pedal back up with my toe. If I pumped the pedal a few times it all seemed fine again but it was only a temporary fix

deffo try the fluid thing first though like vwbassett suggested. got my fingers crossed for you fella.

exact same issue with mine when i first got it. slave cylinder faild pedal stuck to the floor and had to drive to the garage and change gears without the clutch.
although seat changed the master cylinder twice and had the car for a week before realising it was the slave cylinder? and and worse part was they still charged me for changing the master cylinder even tho there was nothing wrong with it

 

[AzRiz]

Just a bit of info for you mate, got a MK4 Golf myself:

When my clutch pedal snapped a few months back, I left it at my mate's garage to deal with it for me as I was busy. He phoned me and also said that the master cylinder rod was a tiiiny bit bent, do I want to change it? I said Yeah might as well while it's all open. He did so and when I went to collect the car, the biting point was literally about 3mm from the firewall. I had no choice but to take it at the time as I had no other transport home and was really annoyed about it but while I was driving, 20 minutes later, the pedal literally popped out from only extending back up half way to going in to normal position and behaving normally for the rest of the journey.

When I returned to the car after gym about 2 hours after parking it, it was back in the original situation with the bite at the firewall etc. Again, 15 or so minutes of driving later, it popped out and behaved normal.

For the next 2 mornings in a row, it was bad and gained good position after a while, which I have a feeling was due to warmth in the system making it better again.

Unfortunately though, I can offer no solution as the pedal sorted itself out after 3 days and has been fine ever since. I think it was air from when the guy bled it after changing the master cylinder.

I hope that's of some help to you mate.

Az

 

[AntneeUK]

Yeah, cheers

 

[DPJ]

You could prove (or disprove) there was air in the clutch line by pumping the pedal.

 

[AntneeUK]

Now that it's being used every day it seems OK again, as before it was stood for a week, but at the time I did pump it and it seemed to improve slightly every time. Are you suggesting that I should expect certain symptoms if I keep pumping it now that it seems better?

 

[DPJ]

Are you suggesting that I should expect certain symptoms if I keep pumping it now that it seems better?

No.

 

[AntneeUK]

OK, cheers (had to ask so I could be sure, but didn't think that was what you meant)